Subject: TROMBONE-L Digest - 12 Dec 2002 to 13 Dec 2002 (#2002-153) Date: Saturday, December 14, 2002 12:00 AM From: Automatic digest processor Reply-To: "Trombones and related issues forum." To: Recipients of TROMBONE-L digests There are 26 messages totalling 1003 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Schilke 60 Modification (2) 2. King 607-F Frankenbone 3. useless gadget, hour meter /duty cycle meter 4. Schilke mouthpieces (2) 5. A bit... (2) 6. Standards 7. Mpce. Plating 8. J.E. Barat 9. Need Parts! (2) 10. Thanks Wayne (2) 11. non-German Contras (3) 12. Musicians of the Houston Symphony Web Site 13. Drumline 14. Speakers (5) 15. RATH WEBSITE ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 22:13:47 -0800 From: Gabriel Langfur Subject: Re: Schilke 60 Modification --- Randy Campora wrote: > Scott- > > Did the phrase "turning down a 60" also include the > cutting off of some of > the length as well? Back when I played a 60 (around 1988) I brought it to them to "turn down" the shank so the pitch wouldn't be as low, and Scott Laskey didn't cut anything off the end. I don't recall the conversation exactly, but I think he said it would be a bad idea. A little later on I ordered a custom one with the shorter Bach-style shank and it definitely played better. But other aspects, including the blank, were different also. And besides, I wasn't really good enough yet to tell the fine differences. Gabe __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 07:22:05 +0000 From: Daniel Pliskin Subject: Re: King 607-F Frankenbone Gary, >Also, I might warn you about using wooden mandrels in the >bell. If you wedge it in good, and ANY moisture soaks into the > >wood....say goodbye to the whole project! I did have a moment of anguish when the bell cooled and shrank on the mandrel, and I couldnŐt get it off. It did eventually come off, but I had to use way more force than I usually like to use on a trombone. DanP _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 07:40:35 -0500 From: richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL Subject: Re: useless gadget, hour meter /duty cycle meter Ah, the photo-eye detects the lip! Great idea, I never thought of doing it that way. I was fixated on detecting vibration, and that isn't really necessary. I had more trouble figuring out the timer - I see you like the Red Lion hour meter. Don't you need a relay to run more current into that? Part number? Since I couldn't locate a stopwatch/kitchen timer/etc that would take an input (they will take an input, but they need a separate "event" to stop the clock) my last thought experiment involved a 120 V relay and a cheap electric analog clock, the little bedside ones. Can't use a digital, they go back to 12:00 when you cut power, and too many of them have battery backup, but you can still get a cheap electric clock with actual hands. Might want to buy a few extra, they probably won't be around much more. Stick them in the garage with the Beta tape collection . Anyway, the theory is the clock gets power and runs when the relay pulls in, stops when it drops out. Of course you only get 12 hours, but it is rare for me to exceed that in a day. -----Original Message----- From: Pat & Jo McFarland [mailto:mcfarlan@midiowa.net] Sent: Thursday, December 12, 2002 6:59 PM To: richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL; TROMBONE-L@PO.MISSOURI.EDU Subject: Re: [TBN-L] useless gadget, hour meter /duty cycle meter Forgive me. I'm catching up on old e-mails. You could use a light-weight plastic fiber optic bundle mounted to the outside of the mouthpiece just below the level of the rim (duct tape it in place if you like). The fiber optic bundle connects to a little photoelectric sensor (Banner, Omron, Allen-Bradley, Radio Shaft, or whatever...) - used in proximity mode - located on the bell. The output of the photoelectric sensor controls the input to a little watch-battery-powered solid-state timer (Red Lion, Omron, Durant, Radio Shaft...). Wala... no custom-made parts... everything off the shelf. I may try it! Pat (The Control Systems Geek) McFarland ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 6:33 AM Subject: [TBN-L] useless gadget, hour meter /duty cycle meter > This is not a useless gadget at all. > > Many of us have thought about it, some of us discussed building it, at least > one of us (ah, that would be me) actually gone to Radio Shack and browsed > through the parts rack, but as far as I know nobody has built one yet. > > Which one of you built the LED lights? Craig maybe? > > Anyway, you don't want a mercury switch. You need a VOX, a voice operated > switch like from an old cassette recorder, and you need a timer. The timer > is a little harder to figure an easy off the shelf solution for. There are > hour meters available that come in 24 VAC and 120 VAC versions, but that's a > pretty gross measurement as well. An easy fix would be to use the VOX, > clipped to the bell, and run a line to a PC; seems like a simple Basic > peek and poke would give you the answer, but it wouldn't be portable. You > could use the switch closure from the box to run power to a relay that would > run an electric clock, but it has to be the old analog dial kind, the new > digital ones keep time or start again from zero. The problem I see is > getting a start-stop signal in to the timer, and most of the stopwatches and > kitchen timers aren't built to let you do that easily. I hadn't thought of > a chess clock, but again the problem is having the start and stop signals > symmetrical. Anybody who knows what they are doing should be able to solve > this one, unfortunately I'm just a hacker at this. If you don't mind > spending the money, you can get a datalogger called Hobo from Onset. We use > the temperature/humidity ones at work. They are about an inch and a half > square, quarter inch thick, self powered, and measure continuously until you > download into a computer. They run $60 to $80 each. They make a similar > one that will monitor vibration and some people use them to infer duty cycle > on equipment. I have no experience with that type though. > > I do have a large digit Radio Shack kitchen timer and I start and stop it > whenever I practice. I know how much practice time I really put in, because > I stop it if the phone rings or the kids need something. But I don't know > what percentage of that time is actually making noise with the horn, and > that seems like a useful thing to know. > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 10:04:44 -0500 From: Randy Campora Subject: Re: Schilke 60 Modification Yes, that's kind of why I posted my experience recently because previously I had known of "turning down" the outer shank so it will go in farther, but this recent modification results in an outer shank that is is in every spec identical to a Bach (shorter and different taper), but you still have the inner backbore as a Schilke design except that the last taper is a bit shorter. Thanks for your explanation, that's kind of what I thought, that when we talk about "turning down" a mouthpiece for most that means only altering the outer shank, and for others hip to the "secret" it also involved cutting off the end and cleaning out the inside a little bit. Interestingly, Laskey's bass mouthpieces use a Bach style shank and backbore design (maybe the shank is a tiny bit longer than a Bach, I can't remember), not a whole lot of Schilke-isms in his new ones. I think players who like Bach m'pieces will like them quite a bit, but I can't make that kind of backbore work for me--too many hours of trying to figure out in the practice room how to make a Schilke work right I guess. Thanks again Gabe, ~RC At 10:13 PM 12/12/2002 -0800, Gabriel Langfur wrote: >Back when I played a 60 (around 1988) I brought it to them >to "turn down" the shank so the pitch wouldn't be as low, >and Scott Laskey didn't cut anything off the end. I don't >recall the conversation exactly, but I think he said it >would be a bad idea. A little later on I ordered a custom >one with the shorter Bach-style shank and it definitely >played better. But other aspects, including the blank, were >different also. And besides, I wasn't really good enough >yet to tell the fine differences. > >Gabe ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 09:03:55 -0600 From: s76lewis Subject: Schilke mouthpieces I have a King 4B that plays very flat with a Schilke 51. It is a large shank. Do I need to have anything done to it besides shave the pretty silver coating off the shank? Also I tried an older baritone (not mine)with a Schilke 57 bass trombone mouthpiece and it sounded an "A" instead of a Bb on the tuner. I 'll bet that mouthpiece is also too long. Has anyone heard of "A" instead of "B" before? Sandy Lewis ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 16:12:26 +0100 From: Howard Weiner Subject: A bit... of non-trombone humor: A man goes to an exotic tropical island for a vacation. As the boat nears the island, he notices the constant sound of drumming coming from the island. As he gets off the boat, he asks the first native he sees how long the drumming will go on. The native casts about nervously and says "very bad when the drumming stops." At the end of the day, the drumming is still going and is starting to get on his nerves. So, he asks another native when the drumming will stop. The native looks as if he's just been reminded of something very unpleasant. "Very bad when the drumming stops," he says, and hurries off. After a couple of days with little sleep, our traveller is finally fed up, grabs the nearest native, slams him up against a tree, and shouts "What happens when the drumming stops?!!" "Bass solo." +++++++ -- Howard Weiner weiner@privat.toplink.de http://www.odilia.ch/howard-weiner If vegetarians eat only vegetables, what do humanitarians eat? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 09:39:55 -0600 From: Jeff Albert Subject: Re: A bit... A slight variation/addition that I heard, is as the visitor walks through the island he hears a voice from the bushes..."pssst, that's not our regular drummer." Jeff Albert www.jeffalbert.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Trombones and related issues forum. [mailto:TROMBONE- > L@PO.MISSOURI.EDU] On Behalf Of Howard Weiner > Sent: Friday, December 13, 2002 9:12 AM > To: TROMBONE-L@PO.MISSOURI.EDU > Subject: [TBN-L] A bit... > > of non-trombone humor: > > A man goes to an exotic tropical island for a vacation. As the boat nears > the island, he notices the constant sound of drumming coming from the > island. As he gets off the boat, he asks the first native he sees how long > the drumming will go on. The native casts about nervously and says "very > bad when the drumming stops." > > At the end of the day, the drumming is still going and is starting to get > on > his nerves. So, he asks another native when the drumming will stop. The > native looks as if he's just been reminded of something very unpleasant. > "Very bad when the drumming stops," he says, and hurries off. > > After a couple of days with little sleep, our traveller is finally fed up, > grabs the nearest native, slams him up against a tree, and shouts "What > happens when the drumming stops?!!" > > "Bass solo." > > +++++++ > > -- > Howard Weiner > weiner@privat.toplink.de > http://www.odilia.ch/howard-weiner > > If vegetarians eat only vegetables, what do humanitarians eat? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 11:24:25 -0500 From: Walter Barrett Subject: Re: Standards Thus spake, not Zarathustra, but Douglas Yeo > The talk about equipment, endorsements and such, combined with a high > volume of private email generated from my website on the subject of > excellence and standards, reminds me of something I've known of for > many years but which I've never mentioned on the list. It's all > about honesty. > > In 1983, professor Jacob Neusner of Brown University published a > commencement address in Brown University's "The Daily Herald" (June > 12, 1983). It has subsequently been reprinted in many publications > including "Elements of Argument" (Fifth Edition), edited by Annette > T. Rottenberg. The ensuing controversy resulted in Neusner not > giving the address at commencement; he left Brown in 1990 for > teaching positions at the University of South Florida and Bard > College. > > See it at: > > http://www.acsu.buffalo.edu/~breslin/texts/neusner_graduates_didnt_hear.html > > If you haven't read it, you should. If you have read it, you should > read it again. Anyone involved in education on any level knows what > this is about. When a person complains that the road to excellence > is too hard, this is something to put under his pillow. > > -Doug Yeo Honest, indeed, but through his own filter of (what comes across to me as) extreme bitterness. I don't know anything of Professor Neusner's tenure at Brown or elsewhere, but I found myself wondering if he actually tried to do something about the lack of accountability or standards that he saw? Or, did he just let it go on, while he stood complaining from the sidelines? Hopefully, the former... Walter Barrett "If the lips are gone, the teeth are cold." -Chinese proverb. "Human mouths have two lips: whether they speak good or evil is up to you." -Chinese proverb. Yamaha Artist/Clinician Tenor, Alto, Bass Trombones Euphonium Bass Trumpet Tuba ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 08:28:02 -0800 From: Galen McQuarrie Subject: Re: Schilke mouthpieces My understanding is that you also need to cut several milimeters from the end of the shank because the long shank, if uncut, will extend past the "venturi" of the leadpipe and adversely alter the tonal characteristics. This was discussed on the list several months ago. I have a Schilke 51 mpc that I use on my Bach 42 BO, but I have been able to compensate for the excess length of the shank by positioning the tuning slide and I still have about a quarter inch left. If I needed to, I would order a Morse shank mpc. rather than grinding away the plating on the shank. I am a slave to aesthetics, I guess. --Galen McQuarrie -----Original Message----- From: s76lewis [mailto:s76lewis@BELLSOUTH.NET] Sent: Fri 12/13/2002 7:03 AM To: TROMBONE-L@PO.MISSOURI.EDU Cc: Subject: [TBN-L] Schilke mouthpieces I have a King 4B that plays very flat with a Schilke 51. It is a large shank. Do I need to have anything done to it besides shave the pretty silver coating off the shank? Also I tried an older baritone (not mine)with a Schilke 57 bass trombone mouthpiece and it sounded an "A" instead of a Bb on the tuner. I 'll bet that mouthpiece is also too long. Has anyone heard of "A" instead of "B" before? Sandy Lewis ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 16:41:28 +0000 From: robert.osterlund@ATTBI.COM Subject: Re: Mpce. Plating Walter: Following your lead, I found a Warburon Dealer just north of here, The Brass Bow, in Arlington Heights, Illinois. I took my nicked, pitted "sackbut" mouthpiece to them for a refinishing and silver plating. It wasn't cheap; it cost $48 ($10 for the finishing, $38 for the silver plating). But I am quite pleased with the result. The mouthpiece looks like new! No signs of roughness anywhere. It sparkles, and it sounds great. Now I'm busy practicing for my first "gigs"--I'll be playing a medieval carol with my recorder ensemble in a couple of holiday play dates. In one, I have to process (with the group) while playing. Walking while playing--that will be a challenge! (Yeah, I know: "So what?" you marching band types are thinking.) Thanks for your help. Berto -- robert.osterlund@attbi.com http://earlymusichicago.home.attbi.com/ http://earlymusichicago.org/earlymusichicago/ > Robert- > > I don't know if you ever had your mpce. done, but I saw this link on the > TubaEuph list for Warburton Mouthpieces, and he lists prices for gold and > silver plating. Since it's $50 to get silver plating, if you can buy a new > version of your mpce., that might make more sense. But, if it's an old model > or manufacturer not available any more, then plating is the way to go if you > like the mpce. > > http://www.warburton-usa.com/catalog-custom.htm > > > > Walter Barrett > > "I've always known that the trombone could be played different, that > somebody'd catch on one of these days. Man, you're elected." > -Dizzy Gillespie, to JJ Johnson > > > Yamaha Artist/Clinician > Tenor, Alto, Bass Trombones > Euphonium > Bass Trumpet > Tuba > > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 10:23:31 -0700 From: "Mecham, Bryce" Subject: J.E. Barat Does anyone know where I can find biographical info on J. E. Barat and/or information on his Andante and Allegro? B. Mecham ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 13:58:05 -0500 From: mpurdy@JWPEPPER.COM Subject: Re: Need Parts! J.C.: I do have a dual valve dependent section from a Back 50B with a modified wrap by Chuck McAlexander. It has bracing to make interchangeable with a Shire's single thayer. I haven't really thought about selling it but what would you be willing to offer for it? Mike "J.c. Sherman" cc: Sent by: Subject: [TBN-L] Need Parts! "Trombones and related issues forum." 12/12/2002 02:15 PM Please respond to thetubameister Greetings List: Having exhausted local sources (and Osmun Brass), I am now looking to you all. I have a Reynolds single trigger bass in need of a dual valve bass section (I love the horn but need the low C's and B's). I've installed a King 7B section on an identical horn, so I know it can be done easily. So my question - does anyone out there have a dual valve bass section (preferably dependent, though I won't be too picky) from a conversion or something that I can purchase, levers and all? You can e-mail me off-list. Thanks in advance for any help. Best, J.c. Sherman ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 14:01:12 -0500 From: mpurdy@JWPEPPER.COM Subject: Re: Need Parts! Sorry about the post to the list and the spelling errors. One should look before hitting send. Mike ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 11:54:24 -0800 From: Galen McQuarrie Subject: Re: Thanks Wayne Well....who let Maynard in, and why couldn't they have sobered him up before they gave him his trumpet. I guess I can forgive the wag who desecrated probably my favorite classical passage for the gaffaw that I got out of it. Is NOTHING sacred? --Galen McQuarrie ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Dinwiddie" To: Sent: Thursday, December 12, 2002 10:04 AM Subject: [TBN-L] Thanks Wayne | Wayne Dyess posted the incredible website | http://www.inlex.net/feck/mahler.mp3 | | I just have to say, "Thanks Wayne", for that inspired posting. I mean, I | haven't laughed that much in ten years! | | A truly indescribable performance. I think we probably all know people who | would try to do this kind of thing if they were physically able. | | Just great! You really got my day off to a good start, especially after kind | of a rocky beginning. I needed that! | | Bill Dinwiddie | bill752d@attbi.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 14:57:48 -0500 From: "Dr. Carole Nowicke, Applied Health Science" Subject: Re: Thanks Wayne On Fri, 13 Dec 2002, Galen McQuarrie wrote: > Is NOTHING sacred? Not from those guys...they were kicked off the trumpet list for bad behavior. Carole Nowicke cnowicke@indiana.edu ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 20:57:53 -0000 From: Keith Marr Subject: non-German Contras Another thought that occurs to me after looking over Rath's new website the other day - Their intention is to bring a contrabass (as well as an alto, in addition to the bass mentioned earlier which is ahead of them) into production during 2003. Will this be the only non-German contra in production? Just interested to know. Given the difference in tone quality between UK/US instruments and German, could we be getting a new tone standard? ------------------------ Keith in Bb/F/D www.allthingsmusic.co.uk/entertainers/keith.htm ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 18:44:22 -0600 From: Mike Switzer Subject: Musicians of the Houston Symphony Web Site Here's a web site that I think will interest you. It contains information about many of the issues facing the world-class status of the Houston Symphony. The URL is www.upbeat.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 16:58:04 -0800 From: Tom Izzo Subject: Re: non-German Contras Keith, --- Keith Marr wrote: > Another thought that occurs to me after looking over > Rath's new website the > ahead of them) into > production during 2003. Will this be the only > non-German contra in > production? No, There are Chech Contras in production (Amati/Cervenny). And of course, Edwards builds Contras on order. Well, "F" instruments, anyway. :-) Tom (a purist with the BBb Contra) > > Just interested to know. Given the difference in > tone quality between UK/US > instruments and German, could we be getting a new > tone standard? > > ------------------------ > Keith in Bb/F/D > www.allthingsmusic.co.uk/entertainers/keith.htm ===== Tom Izzo Principal Trombonist, Bristol Renaissance Faire Bass Trombonist, West Suburban Symphony Orchestra Alto/Tenor/Bass/Contrabass Trombones, Tubas, Bass Trumpet, Euphonium, Electric Bass, Percussion http://www.Geocities.com/Vienna/Studio/7875/ (630) 983-1985 __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 20:36:33 -0500 From: Dale Cruse Subject: Drumline Have any of you seen the trailer for the movie =B3Drumline?=B2 If not, you can catch it here: http://www.drumlinemovie.com Athleticism and musicianship supposedly take centerstage. From the looks o= f things, music educators who thought they=B9d finally gotten past movie quotes like, =B3This one time, at band camp....=B2 will have some new things to look forward to. Not sure if that=B9s good or bad yet. ----=20 Dale Cruse www.dalecruse.com Setting you up for online success. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 21:51:35 -0500 From: Tom G Tyson Subject: Speakers I was out today at one of the local malls taking care of a little gift shopping. While there, I popped into the Bose store to sample the current state of the art in speakers. The salesman kindly let me do my comparison listening using my copy of the "London Trombone Sound" CD. I have to say that considering the cost of the various speaker systems, I was less that totally impressed with anything Bose offered when concentrating on bass or contra parts. Either there was virtually no bass at all, or the subwoofer added all kinds of overtones of its own, causing the sound to muddy. Quite a contrast from the piercingly clear mid and high range they offered. As a result, I suspect I'll continue to listen to JJ, Roberts, Yeo, and the rest on my big KEF towers (or a good pair of headphones) for the time being. What do the rest of you feel are good to better than good (I won't say best here) speakers for listening to trombone and brass music? To get the ball rolling, I'm quite happy listening to my British Aerospace KEF 104/2 speakers but wish they were a bit more efficient at frequencies below 45 - 50 Hz. Tom Tyson Bass Trombone ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 21:10:50 -0600 From: Chris Waage Subject: Re: Speakers I worked with installed sound for a couple of years, and the standing joke was "No highs, no lows, you know it's Bose." Chris On 12/13/02 8:51 PM, "Tom G Tyson" wrote: > I was out today at one of the local malls taking care of a little gift > shopping. While there, I popped into the Bose store to sample the > current state of the art in speakers. > > The salesman kindly let me do my comparison listening using my copy of > the "London Trombone Sound" CD. > > I have to say that considering the cost of the various speaker systems, > I was less that totally impressed with anything Bose offered when > concentrating on bass or contra parts. Either there was virtually no > bass at all, or the subwoofer added all kinds of overtones of its own, > causing the sound to muddy. Quite a contrast from the piercingly clear > mid and high range they offered. As a result, I suspect I'll continue to > listen to JJ, Roberts, Yeo, and the rest on my big KEF towers (or a good > pair of headphones) for the time being. > > What do the rest of you feel are good to better than good (I won't say > best here) speakers for listening to trombone and brass music? > > To get the ball rolling, I'm quite happy listening to my British > Aerospace KEF 104/2 speakers but wish they were a bit more efficient at > frequencies below 45 - 50 Hz. > > Tom Tyson > Bass Trombone > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 22:54:46 -0500 From: Craig Parmerlee Subject: Re: non-German Contras At 08:57 PM 12/13/2002 +0000, Keith Marr wrote: >Another thought that occurs to me after looking over Rath's new website the >other day - Their intention is to bring a contrabass (as well as an alto, in >addition to the bass mentioned earlier which is ahead of them) into >production during 2003. Will this be the only non-German contra in >production? No. Haag is the most popular contra in use on the US west coast. I believe it is made in the Netherlands. Also Steve Ferguson is working on a product too. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 23:12:05 -0800 From: jared webster Subject: Re: Speakers I have recently purchased some Paradigm Speakers, and I'm thrilled about how great they sound. www.paradigm.com I got the Monitor series (their middle of the road price wise), and they are well worth every penny!! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Waage" To: Sent: Friday, December 13, 2002 7:10 PM Subject: Re: [TBN-L] Speakers > I worked with installed sound for a couple of years, and the standing joke > was "No highs, no lows, you know it's Bose." > > Chris > > On 12/13/02 8:51 PM, "Tom G Tyson" wrote: > > > I was out today at one of the local malls taking care of a little gift > > shopping. While there, I popped into the Bose store to sample the > > current state of the art in speakers. > > > > The salesman kindly let me do my comparison listening using my copy of > > the "London Trombone Sound" CD. > > > > I have to say that considering the cost of the various speaker systems, > > I was less that totally impressed with anything Bose offered when > > concentrating on bass or contra parts. Either there was virtually no > > bass at all, or the subwoofer added all kinds of overtones of its own, > > causing the sound to muddy. Quite a contrast from the piercingly clear > > mid and high range they offered. As a result, I suspect I'll continue to > > listen to JJ, Roberts, Yeo, and the rest on my big KEF towers (or a good > > pair of headphones) for the time being. > > > > What do the rest of you feel are good to better than good (I won't say > > best here) speakers for listening to trombone and brass music? > > > > To get the ball rolling, I'm quite happy listening to my British > > Aerospace KEF 104/2 speakers but wish they were a bit more efficient at > > frequencies below 45 - 50 Hz. > > > > Tom Tyson > > Bass Trombone > > --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.427 / Virus Database: 240 - Release Date: 12/6/2002 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 23:27:07 EST From: Brothertimmy@AOL.COM Subject: RATH WEBSITE Hey Y'all, Could somebody please send me the Rath web-address (website)? Thanx and happy holidays! Tim (Rip Van Winkle) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 23:32:38 -0500 From: Chris Dearth Subject: Re: Speakers I personally like anything from B&W. I have a set of large bookshelves called DM602's that ran $666 (yes, really) with stands (though they were separate). Mine are not the series III that is on their website (I got mine 4-5 years ago). I used NY Phil Mahler 2, 5th movement chorale into loud passage to test them and they sounded great. They EASILY sound better than any Bose rig (I've heard them all). They are warm, but reproduce well across the whole spectrum. Brass sound really good on these. As you move up in the series, the detail is AMAZING. A buddy and I, about 8 months after I got mine, went to the same shop and listened to a smaller set in the series above mine. Wow. He put in some jazz quintet (I think Miles) music and the definition was amazing. B&W sometimes are not the easiest to find (like Klipsch, Polk, etc) but are worth the look. The set I have, if you leave them on the floor, don't really need a sub that much. If you stand mount them, a sub is nice but still not really necessary. Great mids and highs also. These are definitely worth the cash when looking at comparably priced BOSE. If I ever get another pair of speakers, it will be higher-level B&W's. I've heard their Nautilus line. Three words...Oh...My...Lord!!!!!!!!!! http://www.bwspeakers.com/ Chris Dearth -----Original Message----- From: Trombones and related issues forum. [mailto:TROMBONE-L@PO.MISSOURI.EDU] On Behalf Of Tom G Tyson Sent: Friday, December 13, 2002 9:52 PM To: TROMBONE-L@PO.MISSOURI.EDU Subject: [TBN-L] Speakers I was out today at one of the local malls taking care of a little gift shopping. While there, I popped into the Bose store to sample the current state of the art in speakers. The salesman kindly let me do my comparison listening using my copy of the "London Trombone Sound" CD. I have to say that considering the cost of the various speaker systems, I was less that totally impressed with anything Bose offered when concentrating on bass or contra parts. Either there was virtually no bass at all, or the subwoofer added all kinds of overtones of its own, causing the sound to muddy. Quite a contrast from the piercingly clear mid and high range they offered. As a result, I suspect I'll continue to listen to JJ, Roberts, Yeo, and the rest on my big KEF towers (or a good pair of headphones) for the time being. What do the rest of you feel are good to better than good (I won't say best here) speakers for listening to trombone and brass music? To get the ball rolling, I'm quite happy listening to my British Aerospace KEF 104/2 speakers but wish they were a bit more efficient at frequencies below 45 - 50 Hz. Tom Tyson Bass Trombone ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 22:32:48 -0700 From: paulnshelly Subject: Re: Speakers I'm with Chris...my B&W 602's are a LOT of speaker for the money! I can't add any more than he has already said about them... (BTW, on my last cross-country jaunt, I stopped to see one of our members "who makes very good valves" and noticed that he also has a pair of B&W's in his living room) Best Regards, Paul Paul Hill Bass Tbn Tucson ------------------------------ End of TROMBONE-L Digest - 12 Dec 2002 to 13 Dec 2002 (#2002-153) *****************************************************************