Subject: TROMBONE-L Digest - 6 Oct 2002 to 7 Oct 2002 (#2002-86) There are 16 messages totalling 591 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Something that will REALLY help your trombone playing (7) 2. OTJ Classifieds Update - October 7, 2002 3. Shameless plug 4. opinions wanted: 88H-O vs 88H-CL 5. Emory Remington Tribute 6. Greenhoe productions... 7. Problem with Trom-L commands (2) 8. Trombone Day, October 26th 9. The 600 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 05:32:45 -0400 From: derrick parker Subject: Something that will REALLY help your trombone playing I have been using a contrabass support for some time on my Rath double valver bass which has helped to completely clear up the triggering I had with the ring and little fingers of my left hand and the pain I was getting in my left shoulder. This device fits on the bottom cross brace of the bell section and sits on the back of my hand. Effectively my hand slips into a pocket between the brace and gooseneck tube. I need no fingers at all to support the instrument. I can't exactly remember who I bought it from, it could have been either Laetzsch or Thein, as it was at the ITF at Utrecht. But I do know it cost about 160 euros (dollars). I note that Thein have one advertised on their site for 177 euros. As Craig said the cost is small compared to medical costs or giving up playing. To be honest I think we buying public should insist that all bass trombones be fitted with some sort of support as standard. It's not macho to be support free. Derrick ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 06:28:15 -0500 From: Chris Waage Subject: OTJ Classifieds Update - October 7, 2002 The Online Trombone Journal Classifieds (http://www.trombone.org/classifieds) have been updated as of 6:27 AM CDT on October 7, 2002. - - - - - Thank you for using the OTJ Classifieds! - - - - - OTJ Classifieds Frequently Asked Questions http://www.trombone.org/classifieds/faq.asp OTJ Gift Shoppe: http://www.cafepress.com/cp/store/store.aspx?storeid=trombones If you have any questions or comments about the Online Trombone Journal Classifieds, please contact me at chris@trombone.org. Chris -- ________________________________________________ Chris Waage, Associate Webmaster chris@trombone.org http://www.trombone.org - A web site for trombonists ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 07:01:27 -0600 From: bldrbrs Subject: Shameless plug Hello all, Please take a moment to hit the new Boulder Brass website. http://www.boulderbrass.com This site is still under construction but already contains lots of info about the group, the players, and our concerts. We are in the process of adding a shopping cart feature so you may purchase recordings, publications, and concert tickets. For those that have had difficulty in the past obtaining arrangements from Allen Music Company, most of that catalog will be available from this website. You will find information about our 2002-2003 concert series, February tour of the Pacific Northwest, and our newest CD (which should be available by Christmas). Looking forward to any feedback. Michael Allen Boulder Brass bldrbrs@attbi.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 13:49:23 +0000 From: "J.c. Sherman" Subject: Re: opinions wanted: 88H-O vs 88H-CL The heavier valve cap on the 88-CL lent a solidity and power to the sound, much like a mouthpiece tone-intensifier. Changed the feel of the horn a great deal, and allowed more power and a more deft touch in quiet playing. It would be easy to machine something to solder to the cap of an 88-HO. But, even though I could do this in minutes, I have a thing about having to modify a brand new instrument. I should be able to buy it as an instrument I like already, not on the chance I can improve it. After all, what if I'm wrong? J.c. Sherman > >Regrettably, I think a heavy valve cap would make > >this into a real (affordable) charmer. > > > Surely it can’t be difficult to make the valve cap heavier. You could > solder a large brass washer to it, for example. > > But what will a heavier valve cap do for the sound? > > Inquiring minds… > > DanP > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. > http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 06:55:20 -0700 From: Ralph Bigelow Subject: Emory Remington Tribute In October, 1979, the Eastman School of Music dedicated a rehearsal room to the memory of Emory B. Remington. I have placed scans of the program booklet for that event on the Remington Reunion website. Follow the "Tribute" link from the main page: http://web10.superb.net/thechief Ralph Bigelow ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 08:07:42 -0600 From: Dennis Clason Subject: Re: Something that will REALLY help your trombone playing > Following on from Craig's comments about the rest bar, it seems to me that > the cause of the problem is that manufacturers have moved the bell brace > back. On a number of my older trombones, including the Duo > Gravis, you wrap > your hand around the bell brace to sit comfortably on the triggers. > > My question is why do we think the manufacturers have made this change? Is > it to let the bell vibrate more freely? There ought to be a good > reason when > the change is made at the expense of the player's handling comfort. I don't know if there's an acoustic reason for moving the bell brace, but I do know that some of the older 'bones that left the brace in position were very uncomfortable for me to play. The brace sat in the crotch of my thumb and caused my hand to cramp. The Gravis was particularly bad in that regard. I think it was the fact that you needed to have a double-jointed left thumb to play that horn as it came from King. Perhaps it's how my nerves are laid out in my left hand, but was never able to adapt to having to use my thumb while a brace was shoved into it. I play a double thayer Bach 50. Yes, it's heavy, but using a Yeo-type grip takes care of that. Dennis -- Dennis L. Clason, Ph.D. Associate Professor University Statistics Center New Mexico State University ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 14:08:18 +0000 From: "J.c. Sherman" Subject: Re: Something that will REALLY help your trombone playing I would certainly never disuade anyone from the Greenhoe Rest Bar. Though my experience with Greenhoe products is limited to "the brace" (which is very well made and does work as advertised), I just thought I'd mention that I am equally satisfied with my "Bullet Brace" from Edwards. I have it on my bass, and with the padded grip on it, I finally solved yearsw of arm, wrist and hand pain. It's the same price as the Greenhoe. I don't advocate it as better - it's just what I bought, and I like it too. Maybe I'll try a Greehoe Rest Bar on my Bach 42 someday. J.c. Sherman > Dear list members, > I am usually a little bit skeptical (sometimes a lot skeptical) about > gadgets that will help your playing. However, I have found something that > really will help your playing, especially if you play a large bore tenor > trombone (F-Attachment or not) or bass trombone. Before I tell you what it > is, let me first say that I have never had a problem holding the horn > because I have rather large hands (I can easily stretch an 11th on the > keyboard). But, I honestly don't know how I got along with out this gadget > for the past 25 years. > > I am referring to the Greenhoe Rest Bar. > > I recently purchased a straight gooseneck from Gary, and Glenda, his > lovely wife, forgot to put the Rest Bar in the package. I called Gary > immediately, and while I do have large hands, one would have had to have the > hands of Godzilla to hold the horn the conventional way. He then asked me if > the Rest Bar was in the package, and I said NO. I had no idea that it was > part of the deal when I bought the straight gooseneck. Gary assured me that > it was, and that Glenda would get it out to me immediately. I received it in > the mail today. and I'll admit, it does look a bit strange. However, when I > attached it to my gooseneck, and did a small adjustment, I never knew that > holding a trombone could be so comfortable. I was never uncomfortable > before. What this little contraption does is to eliminate any stress > whatsoever in the hand involved in holding the horn. I'm so excited about > this that this is one thing that I'm going to strongly recommend to all of > my students. If you play a 42B or an Edwards large bore tenor, then I would > recommend that you first check out this contraption on the Greenhoe website > (www.greenhoe.com) and then order one. I assure you that it will be the best > $100 that you've spent on anything trombone related. Gary even includes a > felt-lined radiator clamp that allows you to position the rest bar exactly > where you want it, and you can play with it that way forever, or you can > have your local repair shop solder it on for you. I would recommend it > whether or not you purchase a Greenhoe valve section or not. Glenda assures > me that the Rest Bar can be modified to fit any trombone. If you have any > questions, just call Gary or e-mail him at gary@greenhoe.com and I feel very > sure that Gary will give you world class service and if you don't like it, > then you can surely send it back to him within a reasonable amount of time > for a prompt refund of your money. I showed it to 2 of my students today and > they both really liked it. > > Incidentally, in the past I have really toasted some companies that > refuse to stand behind their product. I can say enthusiastically that Gary > Greenhoe is a man of the highest possible integrity and he wants to make > sure that you're very happy with ANY product that you purchase from him. > Putting his name on his valve section and the other instrument components > that he sells obviously means an awful lot to him, and I know from personal > experience that he will NOT knowingly send out a second rate product. If > you're not happy with anything that you purchase from him, then he will do > whatever it takes in order to satisfy you or refund your money. I can't > thank him enough for what his products have done for my playing. > > Paul Kemp > Chattanooga Symphony > www.trbnplyr.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 14:14:50 +0000 From: Jason Akai Subject: Greenhoe productions... The horn I am using now is a Greenhoe build - an Edwards bell with the dual Thayer system. Its easily the best horn I've ever played on. I cannot recommend it more highly. _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 15:27:41 +0100 From: Adrian Drover Subject: Problem with Trom-L commands Just got back from 2 week vacation to be greeted by 600 unread mails. My son tried several times to postpone my subscription while I was away, using the info posted 6/5/02. Is there a more up to date list? If anyone has tried to contact me personally within the last 2 weeks, could you please try again. There's no way I'll be able to clear my backlog other than by the big delete key. Cheers and Hello Again, Nice to be back, A. Adrian Drover ADIOS, Scotland www.adios.co.uk Personal email: adrian@adios.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 07:42:05 -0700 From: List Monitor Subject: Re: Problem with Trom-L commands The most simple method is to visit http://po.missouri.edu/cgi-bin/wa You will need to register (using the e-mail address to which your trombone-l messages are sent), and you will then be able to manage your subscription through the web interface. LM ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: Adrian Drover Reply-To: Adrian Drover Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 15:27:41 +0100 >Just got back from 2 week vacation to be greeted by 600 unread mails. My >son tried several times to postpone my subscription while I was away, using >the info posted 6/5/02. Is there a more up to date list? > >If anyone has tried to contact me personally within the last 2 weeks, could >you please try again. There's no way I'll be able to clear my backlog other >than by the big delete key. > >Cheers and Hello Again, Nice to be back, A. > >Adrian Drover >ADIOS, Scotland www.adios.co.uk >Personal email: adrian@adios.co.uk > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 08:38:00 -0700 From: Dean Hubbard Subject: Trombone Day, October 26th Trombone Day 2002 Hosted by A&G Music of Oakland, UNION MUSIC of San Francisco and California State University Hayward Saturday, October 26, 2002 in the CSUH Music Building This free event will feature: ~San Francisco Opera Orchestra Low Brass Section Playing excerpts ~Tom "Bones" Malone, David Letterman Show, the Blues Brothers and countless recordings ~David Ridge, bass trombone with the San Francisco Opera Orchestra, CSUH faculty ~Billy Robinson and the Bay Bones, massive trombone ensemble will perform in concert ~Art Sares, trombone legend will perform the music of Tommy Dorsey with a trombone sextets and rhythm section Event Schedule Registration begins at 8:30 AM 9:00 AM: SF Opera Orchestra Low Brass, Mac Kenley, Don Kennelly, Dave Ridge and Zack Spellman 9:30AM: David Ridge masterclass (bring your horns) 11:00 AM: Tom Bones Malone 12:35-1:15 Lunch 1:20 PM: Bay Bones conducted by Billy Robinson 2:40 PM: Arthur Sares 4:20 PM-5:30 PM Trombone Choir (bring your horns, all are encouraged to participate) In addition to these fine artists, A&G Music of Oakland and Union Music of San Francisco will have displays of instruments and accessories. All events are free to interested parties. Parking on the CSUH campus is free and plentlyful. For bios and a map: http://www.agmusic.com/tromboneday.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 17:16:30 +0100 From: Keith Marr Subject: Re: Something that will REALLY help your trombone playing Maybe it depends on the size of your hand? I've got large hands (I can stretch a 12th on the white keys of the piano, just in case anyone ever wonders why my music has a lot of parallel 12ths! ) and I find the Duo Gravis really comfortable to use, exactly because the bell brace is there to anchor my grip. On my TR181 on the other hand (no pun intended) by the time I have one finger on the leadpipe, the next one on the paddle for the Gb valve and the thumb on the F trigger the whole weight of the horn is on my third and fourth fingers - ouch! I must admit to not having paid much attention to the Yeo grip, something I'm always meaning to do. I will have a look at his description of it again on his site. Keith in Bb/F/D ----- Original Message ----- From: Dennis Clason To: Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 3:07 PM Subject: RE: [TBN-L] Something that will REALLY help your trombone playing > I don't know if there's an acoustic reason for moving the bell brace, > but I do know that some of the older 'bones that left the brace in > position were very uncomfortable for me to play. The brace sat in the > crotch of my thumb and caused my hand to cramp. The Gravis was > particularly bad in that regard. I think it was the fact that you > needed to have a double-jointed left thumb to play that horn as it > came from King. Perhaps it's how my nerves are laid out in my left > hand, but was never able to adapt to having to use my thumb while a > brace was shoved into it. I play a double thayer Bach 50. Yes, it's > heavy, but using a Yeo-type grip takes care of that. > > Dennis ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 12:00:20 -0700 From: emrose79@PACBELL.NET Subject: Re: Something that will REALLY help your trombone playing I use two double valves, a Besson 943 and a Conn 112H. I've found that I can use the Besson without too much trouble (well....I AM thinking of getting an Ergo bone, but that's another story) however I had a lot of trouble holding the Conn. I had the Greenhoe Rest Bar attached, and it is amazingly better. I guess it just depends on how it's made, with very subtle differences in the placement of the parts.... Ed "J.c. Sherman" wrote: > > I would certainly never disuade anyone from the Greenhoe Rest Bar. Though my > experience with Greenhoe products is limited to "the brace" (which is very well > made and does work as advertised), I just thought I'd mention that I am equally > satisfied with my "Bullet Brace" from Edwards. I have it on my bass, and with > the padded grip on it, I finally solved yearsw of arm, wrist and hand pain. > It's the same price as the Greenhoe. I don't advocate it as better - it's just > what I bought, and I like it too. > > Maybe I'll try a Greehoe Rest Bar on my Bach 42 someday. > > J.c. Sherman > > Dear list members, > > I am usually a little bit skeptical (sometimes a lot skeptical) about > > gadgets that will help your playing. However, I have found something that > > really will help your playing, especially if you play a large bore tenor > > trombone (F-Attachment or not) or bass trombone. Before I tell you what it > > is, let me first say that I have never had a problem holding the horn > > because I have rather large hands (I can easily stretch an 11th on the > > keyboard). But, I honestly don't know how I got along with out this gadget > > for the past 25 years. > > > > I am referring to the Greenhoe Rest Bar. > > > > I recently purchased a straight gooseneck from Gary, and Glenda, his > > lovely wife, forgot to put the Rest Bar in the package. I called Gary > > immediately, and while I do have large hands, one would have had to have the > > hands of Godzilla to hold the horn the conventional way. He then asked me if > > the Rest Bar was in the package, and I said NO. I had no idea that it was > > part of the deal when I bought the straight gooseneck. Gary assured me that > > it was, and that Glenda would get it out to me immediately. I received it in > > the mail today. and I'll admit, it does look a bit strange. However, when I > > attached it to my gooseneck, and did a small adjustment, I never knew that > > holding a trombone could be so comfortable. I was never uncomfortable > > before. What this little contraption does is to eliminate any stress > > whatsoever in the hand involved in holding the horn. I'm so excited about > > this that this is one thing that I'm going to strongly recommend to all of > > my students. If you play a 42B or an Edwards large bore tenor, then I would > > recommend that you first check out this contraption on the Greenhoe website > > (www.greenhoe.com) and then order one. I assure you that it will be the best > > $100 that you've spent on anything trombone related. Gary even includes a > > felt-lined radiator clamp that allows you to position the rest bar exactly > > where you want it, and you can play with it that way forever, or you can > > have your local repair shop solder it on for you. I would recommend it > > whether or not you purchase a Greenhoe valve section or not. Glenda assures > > me that the Rest Bar can be modified to fit any trombone. If you have any > > questions, just call Gary or e-mail him at gary@greenhoe.com and I feel very > > sure that Gary will give you world class service and if you don't like it, > > then you can surely send it back to him within a reasonable amount of time > > for a prompt refund of your money. I showed it to 2 of my students today and > > they both really liked it. > > > > Incidentally, in the past I have really toasted some companies that > > refuse to stand behind their product. I can say enthusiastically that Gary > > Greenhoe is a man of the highest possible integrity and he wants to make > > sure that you're very happy with ANY product that you purchase from him. > > Putting his name on his valve section and the other instrument components > > that he sells obviously means an awful lot to him, and I know from personal > > experience that he will NOT knowingly send out a second rate product. If > > you're not happy with anything that you purchase from him, then he will do > > whatever it takes in order to satisfy you or refund your money. I can't > > thank him enough for what his products have done for my playing. > > > > Paul Kemp > > Chattanooga Symphony > > www.trbnplyr.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 14:37:48 -0500 From: Bill Dinwiddie Subject: The 600 Welcome back Adrian, While you were gone we found out that one of our members is the winner of the $10,000,000 Grand National Power Ball Lottery and that the winning number is almost certainly concealed in one of those 600 E-Mails that you have on your hard drive. Of course, if you don't think that you are likely to be the winner, than go ahead and use that delete key, but.............. Bill Dinwiddie bill752d@attbi.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 15:59:47 -0400 From: Lisa & Patrick Bates Subject: Re: Something that will REALLY help your trombone playing From: Keith Marr > Maybe it depends on the size of your hand? I've got large hands (I can > stretch a 12th on the white keys of the piano, just in case anyone ever > wonders why my music has a lot of parallel 12ths! ) and I find the Duo > Gravis really comfortable to use, exactly because the bell brace is there to > anchor my grip. Wouldn't say it's the size of the hand, mine's not very big and the Duo works fine for me! Patrick Bates ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 20:09:28 +0000 From: Daniel Pliskin Subject: Re: Something that will REALLY help your trombone playing > > Maybe it depends on the size of your hand? I've got large hands (I can > > stretch a 12th on the white keys of the piano, just in case anyone ever > > wonders why my music has a lot of parallel 12ths! ) and I find the >Duo >Wouldn't say it's the size of the hand, mine's not very big and the Duo >works fine for me! So is this yet another argument about whether size matters. I certainly does in the junk mail business. DanP _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ End of TROMBONE-L Digest - 6 Oct 2002 to 7 Oct 2002 (#2002-86) **************************************************************