Subject: TROMBONE-L Digest - 28 Sep 2002 to 29 Sep 2002 (#2002-78) There are 8 messages totalling 246 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Orchestral Equipment Size -- use of assistant princip als (2) 2. mingus big band (2) 3. Olds Bass Trombone for Sale 4. Jazz repertory 5. A Collection of LPs 6. Getzen 3047-AF for sale ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 13:46:43 +0100 From: Keith Marr Subject: Re: Orchestral Equipment Size -- use of assistant princip als If you ever get a chance to read Berlioz's treatise on orchestration you will see the pros and cons of being a visionary. In his orchestra of the future there were going to be about 500 players, including 30 harps! Interestingly, in his book Trombone Technique, Denis Wick goes into detail about dynamic markings of various composers. In addition to the obvious (i.e. mark down Mozart a couple of notches etc) he talks about specific composers. Sibelius for example you actually play the part louder than written as he was writing for an orchestra that was undermanned in the strings. The point of all this waffle is that when he came to Berlioz he said that you could play his parts exactly at the dynamic written, as it if was written today. This is based on the equipment used in British orchestras in the 1970s although it was much bigger than that used in Berlioz's day. Wick was using an 8H or 88H at the time. Intriguing? I think a sub-principle on first has been common practice in Horn sections for many years. The principle took the solos, and any material prior to them that kept his chops ready. Don't pity the woodwind in the Berlioz Requiem by the way, there's thousands of them! After a while you long for a good brass blow to cover their wailing! Keith in Bb/F/D > It will be interesting what extra brass they bring in for the grand performances > of Requiem and Symfonie Fantastique or his Te Deum. > I pitty the poor woodwind players sitting if front of all that brass that > Berlioz called for, but it is their choice. > > The interesting thing is that the instruments of the day, were pea shooters > compared to the bombers that the trombonists use now. > He (Berlioz) was sure ahead of his time, IMHO. > Mind you I love the big and grandiose! > Cheers > Larry White ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 18:55:00 +0200 From: Simon Bailey Subject: mingus big band hi all, i've just read that the mingus big band is playing in a venue in innsbruck (where i live). does anybody know this band and if they're worth going to see? greetings, simon. -- Innsbruck, Austria ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 16:29:59 -0400 From: Wil Salo Subject: Olds Bass Trombone for Sale I'm putting this on the list before going to eBay: Circa 1949 Olds single rotor bass trombone with slide tuning made at Olds' Los Angeles factory. This horn has been totally reconditioned by experts to look and play like a new horn. It has new inside slide tubes and the buffing was done so carefully that there is no degradation of the bell engraving or serial numbers. It speaks easily and feels as flexible as a smaller horn. With a very warm sound, it's adaptable to many different situations from brass quintets to concert bands. It will come with a very protective soft case. Price is $900.00 plus shipping. Pictures are available. Wil Salo ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 16:22:06 -0600 From: Al MacDonald Subject: Re: Jazz repertory Craig, I am also the president of a community orchestra. The subject you bring up is a constant thread on orchestralist (www.orchestralist.org). The balance between "standards" and more adventurous programming is a constant battle, complicated by the economics of programming newer material for which rental and rights fees are still applicable. For example, we did Shostakovich 5 last year (expensive), and got questions about whether it was worth it, since Beethoven and Brahms can be done for free. I suggest you join the orchestralist and lurk for a while. It's not as active as trombone-l, but there are several posts a day, and the level of discourse is high. There are quite a few conductors, music directors, and composers who contribute. Dave Daniels is a regular, always a plus. Al MacDonald ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 18:35:21 -0500 From: Eric & Candice Swanson Subject: Re: A Collection of LPs Chris Waage wrote: > My wife's grandfather recent passed away, and being the musician of > the family, I was given his collection of LPs ........ I'm looking for > suggestions. Chris, Check with the local colleges about donating them to the music library. If they'll accept them, you could take a nice tax deduction. If they won't take them, then donate them to Goodwill and take a deduction for the "value". Probably better than selling them on ebay, but you never know. Eric ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 18:36:59 -0500 From: Eric & Candice Swanson Subject: Re: mingus big band Simon Bailey wrote: > hi all, > > i've just read that the mingus big band is playing in a venue in > innsbruck (where i live). does anybody know this band and if they're > worth going to see? > Simon, Yes, it should be a group of top New York players. Eric ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 16:55:42 -0700 From: Andrew Michael Subject: Re: Orchestral Equipment Size -- use of assistant princip als At 1:46 PM +0100 9/29/02, Keith Marr wrote: >Larry White wrote: > > It will be interesting what extra brass they bring in for the grand >performances >> of Requiem and Symfonie Fantastique or his Te Deum. >> I pitty the poor woodwind players sitting if front of all that brass that > > Berlioz called for, but it is their choice. > > >Don't pity the woodwind in the Berlioz Requiem by the way, there's thousands >of them! After a while you long for a good brass blow to cover their >wailing! > And in the Requiem, if properly staged, the only brass in the main orchestra are the french horns. The people I pitied were the ones in the pew in front of us when I was in the third brass choir. We were performing to a standing room only crowd in a cathedral in Sacramento and there was little room behind the last pew. They had to deal with slides between their heads and were the last to rise for the standing ovation at the end. Of course, they may have been deaf by then. On bore size and the Requiem. After a different performance that week, an audience member came up to us and commented on some of the smaller bore horns that were being used for the pedal tones. He seemed to think they were small for such low notes and didn't realize that they were probably appropriate to the original vision. On the other hand, you have to give him credit for knowing a fair bit about trombones. These were performances with the UC Davis symphony plus supporting players (I was in the latter group) and to be honest the horns were largely just what the students owned. Cheers, Andy P.S. this was an interesting turn to the discussion as I read through parts of the Requiem just last night. That was because it is in the same volume of the Brown excerpt books as Mahler 3 and after hearing that on Friday I had to take a shot at the parts. -- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 23:16:27 -0500 From: Jeff Albert Subject: Getzen 3047-AF for sale My trombone liquidation is almost over, but I have one left to sell (before I start buying again :-)) It is a Getzen Custom 3047-AF, with the factory hard case, and I can throw in a mouthpiece if need be. It is one of the earlier ones, before they had interchangeable lead pipes on the Getzens. There is a good bit of lacquer wear on the slide, but the plating on the inners is intact and both the slide and valve are very smooth. $1000.00 and I will cover shipping and insurance. If no one from the list is interested, it will go on ebay around mid-week. Jeff Albert www.jeffalbert.com ------------------------------ End of TROMBONE-L Digest - 28 Sep 2002 to 29 Sep 2002 (#2002-78) ****************************************************************