TROMBONE-L Digest 2393 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: in- & out-breathers by "Fred Hudson" 2) Re: in- & out-breathers by "Hector Bourg Jr." 3) Re: in- & out-breathers by sabutin 4) Re: in- & out-breathers by Craig Parmerlee 5) Re: in- & out-breathers by Gabriel Langfur 6) Re: in- & out-breathers by "Keith Marr" 7) Re: in- & out-breathers by Gabriel Langfur 8) Re: in- & out-breathers by "Daniel Pliskin" 9) Re: in- & out-breathers by sabutin 10) Edwards bell qu.... by "Lisa Nelsen" 11) RE: Edwards bell qu.... by "Gary Greenhoe" 12) RE: Edwards bell qu.... by "Jeff Albert" 13) RE: Edwards bell qu.... by "Gary Greenhoe" 14) Re: in- & out-breathers by "Adrian Drover" 15) Re: Edwards bell qu.... by Walter Barrett 16) bass bone by PCtrombone@aol.com ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2393 Date: Fri, 17 May 2002 12:23:07 -0500 From: "Fred Hudson" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: in- & out-breathers Message-ID: <001201c1fdc7$88dd2c80$301298d8@s0024172501> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: "Adrian Drover" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Sent: Friday, May 17, 2002 11:54 AM Subject: Re: in- & out-breathers > > From: "Craig Parmerlee" > > > The > > body is an amazing thing. If one breathes in, somehow the air knows where > > it is supposed to go. It goes to the lungs and doesn't end up in the > > spleen. > > > Not so sure 'bout that. If I have a couple pints of Guinness before my main > meal, the air seems to forget it has to go to the lungs and finds its way > directly to my large intestine. I then notice there are no in-breathers > anyway near me. > > A. > > Adrian Drover > ADIOS, Scotland www.adios.co.uk > Personal email: adrian@adios.co.uk > Adrian, I usually look forward to your comments as a breath of fresh air when the discussions get too stuffy, but, this one leaves me speechless! Fred Hudson ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2393 Date: Fri, 17 May 2002 14:26:27 -0400 From: "Hector Bourg Jr." To: "Bone List" Subject: Re: in- & out-breathers Message-ID: <0b6201c1fdd0$5be73af0$22533842@hn9nz49oeloz7b> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Not so sure 'bout that. If I have a couple pints of Guinness before my main > meal, the air seems to forget it has to go to the lungs and finds its way > directly to my large intestine. I then notice there are no in-breathers > anyway near me. > > Adrian Drover Trust Adrian to put everything in its proper perspective! Hb **************************************************************************** *** Hector "Butch" Bourg Jr. - Graphic and Web Design - Atlanta, GA Trombonist - Sentimental Journey Orchestra - http://www.thesjo.com ** NOW CELEBRATING TWENTY-SIX SWINGIN' YEARS ** **************************************************************************** *** PLEASE UPDATE your e-dress for me to: sackbutt@attbi.com **************************************************************************** *** ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2393 Date: Fri, 17 May 2002 14:34:23 -0400 From: sabutin To: trombone-l@po.missouri.edu Subject: Re: in- & out-breathers Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Hi all... WAY too much analysis here, I think. In breathers, out breathers, mouth breathers, nose breathers, corner breathers, heavy breathers of all varieties... If I could just bounce a very well focused, very selective blackjack upside the head of ALL you breathers, one that would knock out your "breathing" consciousness while leaving everything else unaffected...a sort of breathing lobotomy...you'd all do just fine. Once you open the Pandora's box of thinking about breathing...unavoidable, in some (but not all, or even most) cases and potentially quite useful...then you are stuck w/having to close it once you are through tinkering w/the process. Like having an automobile, you must close the hood and drive after adjusting the air intake. Most of us animals go through our allotted years w/out a THOUGHT of "how" we breathe, and are no more the worse for it. A active animal, be it human or beast, adult or child, breathes as efficiently as it must unless it has been taught that its natural method of breathing is "wrong". In our own case, humans have in certain cultures been taught that a certain upright, chest out military posture is the way to be, and that any hint of abdominal protrusion is wrong. Babies and young children don't know that...nor do most Guinness drinkers, by the way...and if the Guinness line sounds like a joke, it's not. Not entirely There is a reason why so many brass players have what looks to be a beer belly of some sort by the time they are in their '30s + '40s, and it's not just from drinking or overeating. They use those muscles differently from the anorexic model/pumped up weight trainer driven stereotype figure that rules this culture, and really they use them correctly. As far as the "in" and "out" idea...what goes up must come down, and what goes in must come out. If it's a useful concept for you, by all means use it...but if it IS a useful concept for you, here's another one. You think too much. (Also known as...FUGGEDABOUDIT.) Build your air capacity as much as you can; learn to play with good sound and projection and w/an efficient embouchure (inefficient embouchures being simultaneously the single most important and single most often ignored facet of breathing problems...makes no difference HOW much air you take in or how well you expel it if you are not using it well at the m'pce.), and then... FUGGEDABOUDIT. You'll be better off if you do. Later... S. P.S. The single best breathing tip I know...and one that I learned from watching myself and others when we were winded from violent exercise...is this. After you have taken the deepest, most complete breath you can (which can be likened to a really full yawn...itself a natural expression of oxygen starvation that is brought on by sleepiness and and its concomitant shallow breathing, by the way) and you feel you literally cannot fit any more air into your system, try bending at the waist about 15-30 degrees. You will most likely find that you can fit in another few cups of air, because you have displaced your innards a little and given the lungs more room to expand. This is a VERY useful device when you are confronted by that phrase that, no matter what you do, is just a little too long... Try it and see. Around that same idea...eat and drink less (at least less mass) than you usually do before or during a performance. There is only a finite amount of room inside each torso, and air and food exist in essentially the same space. The less room taken up by one, the more will be available for the other. ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2393 Date: Fri, 17 May 2002 13:39:57 -0500 From: Craig Parmerlee To: trombone-l@po.missouri.edu Subject: Re: in- & out-breathers Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20020517133802.022d97a0@acticalc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 05:54 PM 5/17/2002 +0100, Adrian Drover wrote: Not so sure 'bout that. If I have a couple pints of Guinness before my main meal, the air seems to forget it has to go to the lungs and finds its way directly to my large intestine. I then notice there are no in-breathers anyway near me. I know some people who have mastered that technique. Think of the possibilities if we could get it to go the reverse direction. Those long passages would be a snap, but of course nobody would want to be within nose-shot of the bell. ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2393 Date: Fri, 17 May 2002 12:42:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Gabriel Langfur To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: in- & out-breathers Message-ID: <20020517194214.51974.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- Aaron Roth wrote: > Interestingly, I've heard a slight variant on the baby > theme. Look at a > baby that's crying, one that's really letting loose, and > you'll see it > taking completely full, efficient breaths, then expelling > them with similar > efficiency. > -Aaron Roth And my close friend with a 9-month-old told me that according to what she's read, a baby crying is the loudiest sound a human can produce without mechanical aid. They can approach 110 decibels. Don't mess with mothers of infants. Gabe __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience http://launch.yahoo.com ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2393 Date: Fri, 17 May 2002 20:52:41 +0100 From: "Keith Marr" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: in- & out-breathers Message-ID: <000801c1fddc$6bfc16c0$3d1887d9@tiny> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit So take a 9-month-old baby and teach it a sound embouchure technique. All it needs is someone to work the slide for it. Keith in Bb/F/D ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: in- & out-breathers > > And my close friend with a 9-month-old told me that > according to what she's read, a baby crying is the loudiest > sound a human can produce without mechanical aid. They can > approach 110 decibels. ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2393 Date: Fri, 17 May 2002 13:09:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Gabriel Langfur To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: in- & out-breathers Message-ID: <20020517200902.55977.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- sabutin wrote: > WAY too much analysis here, I think. > > In breathers, out breathers, mouth breathers, nose > breathers, > corner breathers, heavy breathers of all varieties... > > If I could just bounce a very well focused, very > selective > blackjack upside the head of ALL you breathers, one that > would knock > out your "breathing" consciousness while leaving > everything else > unaffected...a sort of breathing lobotomy...you'd all do > just fine. Now Sam, There are people who say the same thing about embouchure. Just put the mouthpiece up to your lips and blow. I don't agree with them either, but you can work yourself into the same kinds of problems with overanalysis of embouchure functions (you told me something like that yourself in fact, if you remember, and you were right;) ). Breathing is easier to deal with because you're using larger muscle groups. I think David G. brought up babies - just breathe naturally, like a sleeping baby. Sleeping babies don't play trombone! You went on to say it's just a matter of controlling the speed of exhalation. What's natural about that? The way we use air playing a wind instrument has little to do with our natural, not-conscious-of-breathing state. We have to learn to do something specialized. Look up from your magazine (no offense meant) sometime during the flute solo in Brahms 4 or Daphnis & Chloe - flutists never tank up the way we poor trombonists do, but they always seem to manage to play these amazingly long phrases against no resistance whatsoever. That's not natural by any means... Brian Frederiksen talked about human physiology being all the same, and that's clearly not true. Sure, our bodies all have basically the same design, but so does a Yugo and a BMW...same basic design principles, radically different performance. It seems to me that there are endless varieties of the details of human physiology, and we all have to learn to use what we have to the greatest advantage. It wasn't so long ago that the "conversational breath" was the standard of trombone pedagogy. I read somewhere that Emory Remington always advocated conversational breaths over the "tanking up" that is more prevalent now, but that he would walk down the street timing his exhalations, trying to increase the distance he could walk while exhaling one slow stream of air. My teacher, Ray Premru, came from that school, and he sure played well. And so does Abbie Conant, so she clearly knows SOMETHING about it. I raised the question because I was curious if anyone else had ever heard of it. Maybe her two broad categories are overly simplified, but two broad categories of anything generally are. Gabe __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience http://launch.yahoo.com ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2393 Date: Fri, 17 May 2002 20:57:31 +0000 From: "Daniel Pliskin" To: trombone-l@po.missouri.edu Subject: Re: in- & out-breathers Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed There is a reason why so many brass players have what looks to be a beer belly of some sort by the time they are in their '30s + '40s, and it's not just from drinking or overeating. They use those muscles differently from the anorexic model/pumped up weight trainer driven stereotype figure that rules this culture, and really they use them correctly. I think we should all thank Sam for giving us an alternative interpretation for our supposed "beer bellies". I consider mine a ãdistended bellyä. No, really, itâs because I really am ãstarvingä by dinnertime. But Iâm still going to stay on my ãdietä, of a salad, for lunch, topped with a bunch of greasy dressing. DanP _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2393 Date: Fri, 17 May 2002 17:42:17 -0400 From: sabutin To: trombone-l@po.missouri.edu Subject: Re: in- & out-breathers Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" --- sabutin wrote: WAY too much analysis here, I think. In breathers, out breathers, mouth breathers, nose breathers, corner breathers, heavy breathers of all varieties... If I could just bounce a very well focused, very selective blackjack upside the head of ALL you breathers, one that would knock out your "breathing" consciousness while leaving everything else unaffected...a sort of breathing lobotomy...you'd all do just fine. Now Sam, There are people who say the same thing about embouchure. Just put the mouthpiece up to your lips and blow. ================ Only fallacy there...buzzing is an unnatural act. Completely unnatural. Breathing however,is quite natural. Like the old joke about someone coming back from France and marveling at the intelligence of the French people...Why, even little the CHILDREN can speak French!!!" Werll, even the little children can breath. In AND out, w/not a thought in the world. If a brass player can blow out the candles on a birthday cake w/out thinking of "breath" in all its manifestations, then that player can simply transfer that act to playing and be just fine. Maybe a little fine tuning...but not much. And (not to get too indelicate on this list full of fart jokes and Guinness belches), if that same player can evacuate his bowels on a particularly resistant day and transfer THAT feeling (w/certain slight adjustments to various tubes + orfices, por favor) to playing, his support will be just fine also. Breathing is "natural", buzzing is not. ================== I don't agree with them either, but you can work yourself into the same kinds of problems with overanalysis of embouchure functions (you told me something like that yourself in fact, if you remember, and you were right;) ). Breathing is easier to deal with because you're using larger muscle groups. ============ Indeed,...which is why so many teachers deal w/it in the first place. It's easy to see, easy to demonstrate. Besides, I'm not advocating overanalysis (ever think about THAT word, ANALysis...?) of embouchure here anyway. What I am saying is that breathing, although important and quite effective as a teaching tool in the hands of people like Arnold Jacobs, tends to become too mental and not enough "just blow the damned horn" in the hands of a number of other people. I'm not al al;l convinced of this "in and out" idea myself. except perhaps as it was used in "The Clockwork Orange". It smells to me of overanalysis at its worst. i don't mean to put Abbie Conant down here...I have heard her play and she is a very good player. However her choices of repertoire (and indeed, perhaps her whole battle w/the Vienna Symphony as well) are, to my way of seeing things, also a little "over-mindful". Each to his (or her) own...I am merely sayong here that although it may "work", the whole thjinking-about-breathing thing is not really necessary in the case of most people, or at best, only a small and useful side topic. ================== I think David G. brought up babies - just breathe naturally, like a sleeping baby. Sleeping babies don't play trombone! =========== THANK GOD FOR SMALL FAVORS!!! ============ You went on to say it's just a matter of controlling the speed of exhalation. ================= I did? I just reread the post...I don't see even a hint of that thought in there. Must be another post. =============== What's natural about that? The way we use air playing a wind instrument has little to do with our natural, not-conscious-of-breathing state. We have to learn to do something specialized. Look up from your magazine (no offense meant) sometime during the flute solo in Brahms 4 or Daphnis & Chloe - flutists never tank up the way we poor trombonists do, but they always seem to manage to play these amazingly long phrases against no resistance whatsoever. That's not natural by any means... ============= No it isn't...but of course they do indeed HAVE resistance (just blow across the top of a bottle to establish that fact), and they have established a balance between that resistance and the amount of air theu are expelling. Just like us. They have LESS resistance, and use less air per second to produce most of their range...thus the balance, or the air would be gone in a split second. The "natural" vs. "unnatural" part of it is this. Ask anybody w/out emphysema or severe asthma to blow out a candle, and POOF, it's gone. Now ask the same cross section of people to accurately buzz through say three octaves on a brass m'pce. Uh uhhhh....ain't gonna happen. Certainlu we need to learn how to control and balance that air, and certainly ALL the "air" teachers have a point...including Abbie Conant, I'm sure. I'm only saying it's not THAT esoteric an act, and seems often to be being overanalyzed to death. ===================== Brian Frederiksen talked about human physiology being all the same, and that's clearly not true. Sure, our bodies all have basically the same design, but so does a Yugo and a BMW...same basic design principles, radically different performance. It seems to me that there are endless varieties of the details of human physiology, and we all have to learn to use what we have to the greatest advantage. It wasn't so long ago that the "conversational breath" was the standard of trombone pedagogy. I read somewhere that Emory Remington always advocated conversational breaths over the "tanking up" that is more prevalent now, but that he would walk down the street timing his exhalations, trying to increase the distance he could walk while exhaling one slow stream of air. My teacher, Ray Premru, came from that school, and he sure played well. And so does Abbie Conant, so she clearly knows SOMETHING about it. I raised the question because I was curious if anyone else had ever heard of it. Maybe her two broad categories are overly simplified, but two broad categories of anything generally are. Gabe ============ Indeed. I have no argument w/anything ANYONE does that helps them play better. In fact, I often use the conversational breath idea myself...I JUST YELL A LOT! Now that just sounds like another little joke...but consider... Which conversation? And...which ensemble/idiom/style/instrument? Mr Remington had roots back into the prewar orchestral styles and probably into a more shall we say restrained society as well. He played (and insisted his students play) a MUCH more resistant instrument than contemporary orchestral horns, the 88H, and a much more resistant m'pce as well. (I bought a Remington m'pce when I started looking seriously into .547 horns several years ago and was amazed at how resistant and closed it was by today's standards. Not a "bad" m'pce...no flames.please...but not exactly free blowing, either.) Anyway...my point was, and remains, that much of the thought about breathing might be better expended on other,less natural aspects of playing. I'm sure my own experiences in the jazz and latin fields have much to do w/this tendency in my own study and teaching. A few years playing w/people like Barry Rogers, Jose Rodriques, Leopoldo Pineda, Dave Taylor, Art Baron and Gary Valente will do more for your breathing capacity, support and control at the embouchure of all that air than all the breath visualizers or theories in the world, I assure you. I have to go play very quietly on B'way now for a few days, so...(whisper...) Bye bye... S. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience http://launch.yahoo.com ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2393 Date: Fri, 17 May 2002 23:39:55 +0100 From: "Lisa Nelsen" To: Subject: Edwards bell qu.... Message-ID: <005901c1fdf3$e2954c40$ef9493c3@hppav> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0055_01C1FDFC.26217F80" Hi to all in Listland..... I have an Edwards bass bell that is red(or rose brass not sure which) it is a 10inch, and is stamped 1627. I have looked on the Edwards web site but can not see this designation, if any one out there can tell me what gauge this bell is I would be grateful.... many thanks Alex. ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2393 Date: Fri, 17 May 2002 18:24:53 -0500 From: "Gary Greenhoe" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: Edwards bell qu.... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Alex, Your Edwards bell is a 22 gauge 10" Soldered flare, Double Spun and Double buffed red brass (90%) copper bell, a perfect candidate for a slick set of Greenhoe rotors! If you need to know more about exactly what your bell is, just let me know. Regards, Gary -----Original Message----- From: owner-trombone-l@po.missouri.edu [mailto:owner-trombone-l@po.missouri.edu]On Behalf Of Lisa Nelsen Sent: Friday, May 17, 2002 5:40 PM To: Trombones and related issues forum. Subject: Edwards bell qu.... Hi to all in Listland..... I have an Edwards bass bell that is red(or rose brass not sure which) it is a 10inch, and is stamped 1627. I have looked on the Edwards web site but can not see this designation, if any one out there can tell me what gauge this bell is I would be grateful.... many thanks Alex. ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2393 Date: Fri, 17 May 2002 18:30:25 -0500 From: "Jeff Albert" To: , "'Trombones and related issues forum.'" Subject: RE: Edwards bell qu.... Message-ID: <003501c1fdfa$d2bf7aa0$f3269d42@jeff> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Is there some method to their numbering system? You hear guys talk about "I've got a 4873CF xl, yada yada", but that means nothing to me. I have an Edwards horn, and I don't know what the number is on the bell unless I look. I just know it's a yellow soldered 21 gauge, or whatever. Jeff Albert www.jeffalbert.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-trombone-l@po.missouri.edu [mailto:owner-trombone-l@po.missouri.edu] On Behalf Of Gary Greenhoe Sent: Friday, May 17, 2002 6:25 PM To: Trombones and related issues forum. Subject: RE: Edwards bell qu.... Hi Alex, Your Edwards bell is a 22 gauge 10" Soldered flare, Double Spun and Double buffed red brass (90%) copper bell, a perfect candidate for a slick set of Greenhoe rotors! If you need to know more about exactly what your bell is, just let me know. Regards, Gary -----Original Message----- From: owner-trombone-l@po.missouri.edu [mailto:owner-trombone-l@po.missouri.edu]On Behalf Of Lisa Nelsen Sent: Friday, May 17, 2002 5:40 PM To: Trombones and related issues forum. Subject: Edwards bell qu.... Hi to all in Listland..... I have an Edwards bass bell that is red(or rose brass not sure which) it is a 10inch, and is stamped 1627. I have looked on the Edwards web site but can not see this designation, if any one out there can tell me what gauge this bell is I would be grateful.... many thanks Alex. ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2393 Date: Fri, 17 May 2002 18:44:58 -0500 From: "Gary Greenhoe" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: Edwards bell qu.... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit HI Jeff, I don't believe that bell is in my catalogue. ;-) The numbering system was generated for any specific logic other than being grouped by smallest bell flare and heaviest gauge proceeding to the largest bell flare and lightest gauge. So, #1 is a 20 gauge 8" annealed, unsoldered, tenor mandrel, 90% copper bell. At the other end of the original list was #1728: 23 gauge, 10", non-annealed, soldered bead, double spun, double buffed, J (tight bass)mandrel, yellow brass bell. In between all of these numbers are 1726 other possibilities originally...with CF added and another set of numbers for the latter small bore bells....plus a few odd numbered bells that were prototypes, and thus designated with a separate code known only to Steve Shires or me. :-O gary -----Original Message----- From: owner-trombone-l@po.missouri.edu [mailto:owner-trombone-l@po.missouri.edu]On Behalf Of Jeff Albert Sent: Friday, May 17, 2002 6:30 PM To: Trombones and related issues forum. Subject: RE: Edwards bell qu.... Is there some method to their numbering system? You hear guys talk about "I've got a 4873CF xl, yada yada", but that means nothing to me. I have an Edwards horn, and I don't know what the number is on the bell unless I look. I just know it's a yellow soldered 21 gauge, or whatever. Jeff Albert www.jeffalbert.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-trombone-l@po.missouri.edu [mailto:owner-trombone-l@po.missouri.edu] On Behalf Of Gary Greenhoe Sent: Friday, May 17, 2002 6:25 PM To: Trombones and related issues forum. Subject: RE: Edwards bell qu.... Hi Alex, Your Edwards bell is a 22 gauge 10" Soldered flare, Double Spun and Double buffed red brass (90%) copper bell, a perfect candidate for a slick set of Greenhoe rotors! If you need to know more about exactly what your bell is, just let me know. Regards, Gary -----Original Message----- From: owner-trombone-l@po.missouri.edu [mailto:owner-trombone-l@po.missouri.edu]On Behalf Of Lisa Nelsen Sent: Friday, May 17, 2002 5:40 PM To: Trombones and related issues forum. Subject: Edwards bell qu.... Hi to all in Listland..... I have an Edwards bass bell that is red(or rose brass not sure which) it is a 10inch, and is stamped 1627. I have looked on the Edwards web site but can not see this designation, if any one out there can tell me what gauge this bell is I would be grateful.... many thanks Alex. ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2393 Date: Sat, 18 May 2002 08:34:57 +0100 From: "Adrian Drover" To: "Sam Burtis" , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: in- & out-breathers Message-ID: <002c01c1fe3e$ac2e56b0$7e09fd3e@homel29g9mgyk9> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "sabutin" > Breathing is "natural", buzzing is not. It is if you mix Guinness and Sunday lunch. A. Adrian Drover ADIOS, Scotland www.adios.co.uk Personal email: adrian@adios.co.uk ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2393 Date: Sat, 18 May 2002 10:35:51 -0400 From: Walter Barrett To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Edwards bell qu.... Message-ID: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Thus spake, not Zarathustra, but Gary Greenhoe... > Hi Alex, > > Your Edwards bell is a 22 gauge 10" Soldered flare, Double Spun and Double > buffed red brass (90%) copper bell, a perfect candidate for a slick set of > Greenhoe rotors! If you need to know more about exactly what your bell is, > just let me know. > > Regards, > Gary > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-trombone-l@po.missouri.edu > [mailto:owner-trombone-l@po.missouri.edu]On Behalf Of Lisa Nelsen > Sent: Friday, May 17, 2002 5:40 PM > To: Trombones and related issues forum. > Subject: Edwards bell qu.... > > > Hi to all in Listland..... > I have an Edwards bass bell that is red(or rose brass not sure which) > it is a 10inch, and is stamped 1627. I have looked on the Edwards > web site but can not see this designation, if any one out there can > tell me what gauge this bell is I would be grateful.... > many thanks > Alex. > Alex- Now that you know every thing there is to know about the bell, does it play any different? Or, alternatively, now that you know "if the bell is the right one for the job" (whatever THAT means!), does it still work for YOU? Knowledge isn't always better than experience and intuition. (Sorry to be such a grump this morning...) ;-) -- Walter Barrett "Why do they call it tourist season, if you're not allowed to shoot them?" -George Carlin Yamaha Artist/Clinician Tenor, Alto, Bass Trombones Euphonium Bass Trumpet Tuba ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2393 Date: Sat, 18 May 2002 12:02:58 EDT From: PCtrombone@aol.com To: trombone-l@po.missouri.edu Subject: bass bone Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_ce.26999237.2a17d532_boundary" List, A friend of mine would like to sell his Yamaha bass bone. It is only 3 years old. The model # is YBL-613G. I don't believe Yamaha make this model anymore. It is a 10 inch bell with a closed wrap. The horn is in Denton so anyone coming to the ITF can make arrangements to see it. Please e-mail me direct if you are interested. Paul ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2393--