TROMBONE-L Digest 1578 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Random question by 108509@wilbur.ld.swin.edu.au (Simon Greatwood) 2) Re: Playing too fast by "Christopher Smith" 3) Bartok results by JennWhaa@aol.com 4) Re: recital by Dennis Clason 5) LISTMONITOR PLEASE READ by " Dan Cloutier" 6) recital by "Adolphus Sprott" 7) recital by "Adolphus Sprott" 8) MPCX January Clearance Sale by Chris Waage 9) Re: recital by Tbcwes@aol.com 10) Re: Random question by "Ben Gurton" 11) Smithsonian Jazz Masterworks Orch. in Wash., DC 1/25-1/28 by sabutin@mindspring.com 12) Re: College, Money, Torture,Involvement by "astro@pconline.com" 13) Re: recital by Trmbman@aol.com 14) RE: Random question from Trombone List by "Marple, Richard L COL BAMC-Ft Sam Houston" 15) RE: Random question by "Marple, Richard L COL BAMC-Ft Sam Houston" 16) RE: Help! I could be torturing you! by richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL 17) Re: just a test by Servo149@aol.com 18) Re: Goofing off (was Re: I was tortured....) by "Joe L. Norcross" 19) Re: Help! I could be torturing you! (again too lengthy) by "Stephen Hunt" 20) Re: Bach Thayer by daboneman 21) Re: recital by John Capon 22) Re: Playing too fast by Chris Tune 23) Re: Home Studio--Microphones and digital recording equipment by Chris Tune 24) Re: is there hope for me? by Delbert Pakiser 25) Re: recital by Dave Burch 26) Mutes to fit pea shooters and cannons by Dave Burch 27) Re: College, Money, and Torture by "Robert Holland" 28) web page by Neobopr@aol.com 29) TEST by Beth Lewis 30) Slide Hampton Concert by "Denver D. Seifried" 31) Rotterdam by "b.v.dijk" 32) My new website !!!!!!!!!! by "Paul D. Kemp, Jr." 33) test by "Joe L. Norcross" 34) Range by "Ellard" 35) To List Monitor by "Ellard" 36) Test by "Kenneth Dowdy" 37) Where's the list? by daboneman 38) 2nd post...Is the list down? by daboneman 39) Gräfe? by "Aaron Roth" 40) Anybody out there? by "John Lavoie" 41) ? by Tbcwes@aol.com 42) Test by "Brooke and Ryan Ringnalda" 43) instruments for sale by Charles 44) test by "Adolphus Sprott" 45) by "Joe L. Norcross" 46) VPO in the News by BrianB@PR-CN.COM 47) Crespo by "Michael Dugan" 48) Re: Recital closing piece by Douglas Yeo 49) RE: Virtual Lessons by richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL 50) REGARDING LIST OUTAGE by Listmonitor Trombone-L 51) HTML in Posts by Listmonitor Trombone-L 52) RE: recital by "Guion, David" <8guion@jmls.edu> 53) David Orch Parts - B flat? by Douglas Yeo 54) RE: Help! I could be torturing you! (again too lengthy) by "Guion, David" <8guion@jmls.edu> 55) RE: Grdfe? by "Guion, David" <8guion@jmls.edu> 56) Re: David Orch Parts - B flat? by "Chuck De Paolo" 57) Re: Range by sabutin@mindspring.com 58) Cultivating a Positive Studio Attitude, Revisited by Donn Schaefer 59) Monday and getting quite high on a morning mate. by "Daniel Pliskin" 60) Re: ? by Mike Coyle 61) Re: College, Money, and Torture by Dennis Clason 62) OTJ Classifieds Update by Chris Waage 63) Re: College, Money, and Torture by Mike Coyle 64) Re: Range by "Rodney Ellard" 65) Re: College, Money, and Torture by Dennis Clason 66) Re: Range by NHSGrizzly16@aol.com 67) List Commands ? by jmonten@ryeneck.k12.ny.us 68) Re: Monday and getting quite high on a morning mate. by Douglas Yeo 69) Re: Monday and getting quite high on a morning mate. by Mike Coyle 70) Re: List Commands ? by Listmonitor Trombone-L 71) Re: List Commands ? by Mike Coyle 72) standards and auditions by richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL 73) valve trombone by "Blythe Polreis" 74) Re: standards and auditions by "Rodney Ellard" 75) range by Charles 76) Re: Home cryo treatments. by Dennis Clason 77) RE: range by "Brandon Moodie" 78) Re: Home Studio--Microphones and digital recording equipment by Anders Carlsson 79) KIng 6B by Anders Carlsson 80) Small big band? by Anders Carlsson 81) DUO GRAVIS by Charles 82) From the Top audition by "James Yardley" 83) Solo competition by "Adolphus Sprott" 84) Lead pipes for King tenors? by CaryMusic@aol.com 85) Re: Home cryo treatments. by "David Morrow" 86) Re: DUO GRAVIS by Earl Needham 87) Re: Recital closing piece by daboneman 88) Re: Range by "Tom Izzo" 89) Re: Range (Izzoism) by Mike Coyle 90) Re: Lead pipes for King tenors? by "Tom Izzo" 91) Re: KIng 6B by Earl Needham 92) Re: DUO GRAVIS by Mike Coyle 93) Slide Hampton Concert by "Denver D. Seifried" 94) Re: College, Money, and Torture by "Robert Holland" 95) Re: DUO GRAVIS by "Tom Izzo" 96) Re: Home Studio--Microphones and digital recording equipment by Chris Tune 97) Seeking advice on opening up valve ports by TRBNTERRY@webtv.net (TRBNTERRY) 98) The Manhattan Wildlife Refuge by "Paul D. Kemp, Jr." 99) A Great Article by Bodie Pfost 100) Re: From the Top audition by "Brooke and Ryan Ringnalda" From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:16 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 12:26:04 GMT From: 108509@wilbur.ld.swin.edu.au (Simon Greatwood) To: "Nicholas Peter Hayes" Cc: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Random question Message-ID: <38899b6b.2432289@wilbur.ld.swin.edu.au> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On Sat, 22 Jan 2000 09:19:51 +0930, you wrote: >Hi Simon, > >The DSO gets paid in sandwiches and busfares! We are a mostly amateur >orchestra - I'll post you some details. > Sorry about the misunderstanding - I assumed that the DSO was one of the ABC orchestras. The amateur orchestra I play with (Maroondah Symphony Orch, Melbourne) is a fee based group with all members over 25 being required to pay subscription. We do about four concerts per year in the local area and occasionally one in regional Victoria. One concert features one of the local choirs and one features one or more concertos. I'm not playing the current concert, unless they need me on trumpet though. My comments remain, though about wages. The American Pro Orchestra SECTION PLAYERS, earn almost twice what our principal players do. It all comes down, it seems, to what your society places values on. Maybe the Sydney Symph players get more than the MSO, as I've only seen figures for the MSO. This is possible since Sydney has more toffs than Melb, but who knows. Further to this, I recently depped for closing night of an amateur theatre company. Admitedly, it was a pretty big band, and out in the far Northern suburbs of Melbourne, but the band got payed $15 a call and most of the band would have travelled more than 1/2 an hour to get there - $15 worth of petrol there and back. $25 I can live with, but there needs to be a limit. On the other hand, the cast members of those companies ae paying levies to the organisations to be a part of the production, while the band gets paid. Go figure. I gues its just that they want good musicians who they can rely on not to stuff up. Simon From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:16 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 14:52:50 GMT From: "Christopher Smith" To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Playing too fast Message-ID: <20000122145250.13117.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed I cannot play them strictly > >because my embouchure is shaking so much because I move the slide so >fast.Ê ++++++++++ It sounds like the horn is bouncing on your face, which is not an uncommon phenomenon. I go over this problem with many of my students. Two things occur to me that might help you: 1) I find it helps when playing a run or sequence of notes in rapid succession to think of the starting position and the ending position, and try to make the slide movements between them as smooth and quick as possible. In this case, if the lick is startiong at the bottom of the bass clef, I'd think of the Gb in fifth as the beginning of my movement and the octave above it as the "destination". The notes (positions) between them are picked off without any stopping and restarting of the slide. 2) Something which is necessary to do to make the above suggestion work is to learn to "suspend" the horn with your left hand so that it does not move around when the slide is in action. The right hand should not support any of the horn's weight, while the left hand should be motionless but NOT stiff and in a death grip. The simplest analogy I can think of is this: We've all seen a waiter carrying a huge tray of food and drinks through a crowded restaurant, stopping and starting, sometimes quite suddenly, without having anything fall off the tray. Now, while carrying a tray is a bit different from holding a trombone, there is a concept of "loose tension" which will allow stability in the midst of large muscle movements. Good waiters, trombonists, weightlifters, etc., have all either learned and used this idea of loose tension, or have put it into practice instinctively. I'm one of the latter group, and have only became aware of it because of my private teaching. And one other thing- the "loose tension" doesn't happen overnight- I find it usually takes people at least a few months of concentrated effort to make the transition to a more relaxed approach. And one OTHER thing- I am always reminding students to NOT try to be "fast", but instead to be "quick". Quick in the same way that animals in nature are quick. Hope this helps, Later, C. http://www.geocities.com/~christo ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:16 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 10:17:27 EST From: JennWhaa@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Bartok results Message-ID: <52.801cc0.25bb2407@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here are the results of my poll. Many people replies with the same answers so I didn't include them all - simply the people who answered first. But I really appreciate everyone who responded to my question. Don't get your feelings hurt if yours doesn't appear! (From: Douglas Yeo ) Use an F bass trombone (I do). ------or------ Play it on the F valve and lip the B down in 7th (I've done that, too). ------or------ Use the "string trick" by which you pull out the F valve to make it an E valve, tie a string (really a steel cable, sheathed in plastic) to it and put the other end on your foot. As you make the gliss in, put your foot out to bring the tuning slide in. B--->F gliss. I did this most times before I got the F bass. (This was first done by Lewis Van Haney). (From: Chad Horsley ) I have always heard that you play the B natural with both triggers then slur up to C and go from there. Hope that helps. (From: Philip Brink ) Try Low B in "trigger" 3rd [fake, falset or priveleged tone] and lip up as you move OUT to 6/7th and move the rest of the way up to first..... (From: Bob Koester ) Start the B natural with both valves and move to the F valve only almost immediately after begginning the gliss. There will be a little bump, but with practice it's hardly discernable. ------or------ Pull F slide for B. Center B at beginning of gliss and lip the pitch up as you come up the slide. Your going to end up with a very flat F but with practice... From: Peter Collins & Sara Wilbur sarapete@total.net>) Tune your f-attachment tuning slide to e and have the tuba player push in the tuning slide as you gliss from the low B to the F. As a poor college student, the F Bass is pretty much out of the question although it is the best solution because that is what Bartok wrote for. The lipping down of the B never seemed like a good option for me - I have two triggers and a pretty nice low B and I am going to play it not lip down to it! The string trick was an option though I didn't really know how to approach setting it up. I have never heard about starting the low B with both triggers and then sliding OUT to a one trigger C and then glissing. Same with the false B in third - I thought that one kind of odd. I have practiced the gliss using the "two triggers and slowly letting go of the second on the way up" method but I am really not into the valve change. I have studied all 23 recordings of the Bartok in our audio library and you can easily hear who used the valve change method and who used the lipping down/up/in/out method. The bass trombone gliss on most of these recordings sounds so radically differen! ! t than the second trombone that I was convinced that the valve change method and the lipping method were not the ones for me. So, I recruited the help of an all too excited tuba player and used the "Tubists are good for something" method (yes that is a joke). I had to use Al Cass on my tuning slide to get it to move quickly enough but the tubist seems to love participating and the brass section finds it humorous. I do find that I need to really concentrate on a rock solid stream of air as the slides come in. Other than that, I don't see what the big deal was about. It's just a gliss....... Tongue in cheek, Jen From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:16 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 08:33:30 MST From: Dennis Clason To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: recital Message-ID: <200001221533.IAA111236@nestor.NMSU.Edu> Addressed to: "Adolphus Sprott" trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu ** Reply to note from Adolphus Sprott 01/21/00 11:17pm -0600 Take a look at Pryor's La Petite Suzanne. It's subtitled Valse Caprice, and is generally a very nice (and underplayed, IMO) Pryor piece. Dennis -- Dennis L. Clason email: dclason@nmsu.edu Department of Economics / University Statistics Center New Mexico State University Las Cruces, New Mexico USA From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:16 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 07:34:40 -0800 From: " Dan Cloutier" To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: LISTMONITOR PLEASE READ Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Language: en Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Listmonitor: I've e-mailed you privately about some of my messages to the trombone-L never showing up, but your e-mail rejects my e-mail to you as spam, so I have to resort to using the List. Sorry. Anyway, there it is. Please lemme know what's the problem when you have a sec. (Come to think of it, since I'm having a problem posting my messages on the trombone-L, this may not go through, either.) --== Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ ==-- Share what you know. Learn what you don't. From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:16 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 09:36:31 -0600 From: "Adolphus Sprott" To: "Trombone-L" Subject: recital Message-ID: <001f01bf64ee$903a5800$8ae0490c@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Tom, I am trying my best to vary the styles of the pieces as much as I can. However, I have to cater to my ability, or lack there of. The Korsakov, Blazhevich, and Guilmant are all quite different in style, and the Manipulations by Molineaux is unaccompanied. Thanks for the suggestions. Hopefully, I'll find something in the near future. Any more suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Weston Sprott weslanke@worldnet.att.net From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:16 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 09:56:11 -0600 From: "Adolphus Sprott" To: "Trombone-L" Subject: recital Message-ID: <000401bf64f1$3c41bba0$8ae0490c@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Where can I find Atlantic Zephyrs by Gardell Simons? From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:16 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 09:59:49 -0600 From: Chris Waage To: Trombone-L Subject: MPCX January Clearance Sale Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" We're down to nine days and counting on the Mouthpiece Exchange January Inventory Clearance sale. Take 30% off every mouthpiece listed in the Exchange - no catch, just savings! http://www.waageworks.com Chris _____________________________________________ Chris Waage basstbn@waageworks.com Visit the Mouthpiece Exchange at http://www.waageworks.com _____________________________________________ From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:16 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 11:14:33 EST From: Tbcwes@aol.com To: weslanke@worldnet.att.net, trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: recital Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/22/00 12:20:42 AM Eastern Standard Time, weslanke@worldnet.att.net writes: << I am a high school player and I will be putting on a recital in a few months. I have decided that I want to play five pieces. I have already chosen four of them, but I can't think of a good closer. So far, my program is: 1. Concerto-Korsakov 2. Manipulations-Molineaux 3. Concerto No. 2-V. Blazhevich 4. Morceau Symphonique-Guilmant 5. ????????? I need some ideas on a good closing piece that will be enjoyable for the audience and won't take me a million years to master (please don't suggest Blue Bells, I have been there, done that, and failed miserably). I'm looking for something with a quick tempo and reasonable range (not above high d). Since this will be my last piece, I am assuming in advance that my chops will be rather tired. Thanks in advance for the help. >> I will also be performing a recital in a few months. Though I am a junior at a conservatory, the last piece on my recital is not a real killer. My recital: (I am not looking at this stuff so don't kill me if I misspell something.) Coat de Bone - Bourgeois Five Pieces for trombone - Krenek Deux Danse - Defaye Intermission add string orchestra, Concerto (alto trombone) - Wagenseil Concertino - Larsson possible closer type encorish thing Anyway, I though you might be interested in the Larsson. It is not too difficult. It is very well written for the trombone. It will take a bit of musical intuition to make the first movement sound like something other than random phrases, but very accessible. Just a thought... -Wes From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:16 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 02:46:31 +1100 From: "Ben Gurton" To: "Trombone-l messages" Subject: Re: Random question Message-ID: <003001bf64ef$db4114a0$594065cb@b7q1d8> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: Adrian Drover To: Trombones and related issues forum. Sent: Saturday, January 22, 2000 6:51 PM Subject: Re: Random question > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Eric and Candice Swanson > To: Trombones and related issues forum. > Sent: Friday, January 21, 2000 2:02 PM > Subject: Re: Random question > > > > Definitely James Morrison for jazz trombone. He also plays great > > trumpet, euphonium, tuba, all the saxes, piano I think, and writes great > > charts. > > I wonder what he does in his spare time? He races his many cars and flies his plane! Not bad. Check out his website at www.jamesmorrison.co.au It's a great site with sound files,photos etc. on it. Ben Gurton freelance, Sydney > > A. > > Adrian Drover (ADIOS Scotland) > Personal: adrian@adios.co.uk > Business: studio@adios.co.uk > http://www.adios.co.uk > > > From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:16 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 12:00:07 -0500 From: sabutin@mindspring.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Smithsonian Jazz Masterworks Orch. in Wash., DC 1/25-1/28 Message-ID: <200001221701.MAA10128@smtp7.atl.mindspring.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi all... I'm going to be in DC w/the SJMO playing + rehearsing this Wednesday through Saturday. The band's playing the music of Dizzy Gillespie, including arrangements by Slide Hampton, and James Moody will be guest soloist....John F. Kennedy Center, 8:30-10:30 PM, Friday + Saturday nights, plus a "Youth Concert" Friday at 12:30 PM. The title of the concert is "Bebop In the New Millennium". I'm sure I'll be able to get a few comps, if anyone's interested. I'll also have quite a few free hours on Thursday, Friday + Saturday if anyone's interested in lessons, and for serious students, the rehearsals can be actually more informative than the concerts. Anyone interested in attending a rehearsal, a lesson, or comps, email me before Wednesday and I'll see what I can do. later... S. From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:17 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 11:01:44 -0600 From: "astro@pconline.com" To: burger2go@compuserve.com Cc: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: College, Money, Torture,Involvement Message-ID: <4.0.1.20000122100258.00e13db0@mail.pconline.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Eric, I cannot thank you enough for this post. You have hit the nail (or nails) right on the head! I am very glad someone had the courage to be as explicit as you were in your post. Academia is a business just like any other. It is insidious in its insincerity. One of my best friends has his PhD. in theory from Yale and got a job in a major University (one of the big ten) as head of the theory dept. It paid $23,000!!!! - that was in 1992. He frequently had to play whore to the administration in the ways you describe. It is disheartening at least, evil at best. We had our share of drift wood at Eastman too (in perf and lit) and I often wonder what they ended up doing and how disappointed they were because no one ever said, "Hey, dude, your never gonna play in a good professional ensemble. I hope your folks don't mind throwing $60,000 at us. Have a great day!" I am also saddened at how little involvement many teachers at the primary level have, or are allowed to have, with their students. I know my private teacher when I was in high school was a real mentor, in every way. He did more to mold my musicianship and love of music than any other person to date. At the big E, however, it was a factory. I saw people treated like damaged goods all the time. There was a time during my sophomore year of college that I experienced some problems that unquestionably effected my work - it was known that I was going through a hard time, but did anyone address it or say "Hey, we need to help you with this and get things back on track." Or at least they could have said "Hey, YOU need to pull it together here" No, they did not. It was only in retrospect that I saw this however, and wondered why no one ever said anything. I actually spoke with a professor of mine much later about this and she admitted that she had seen a problem and was concerned that I was "wasting my gifts". Should someone have said something or done something? Many might say no, it is not their responsibility to be personally involved. I disagree. There are serious responsibilities when dealing with young folks (yeah, even 18 or 19 year olds), there was a time when teachers were mentors and had a personal involvement in kids. They should take more personal notice of things if for no other reason because of the incredible expense of going to school. (I was lucky in this regard because it was during the days of merit scholarships, which I was granted, that covered tuition - I knew many, many others were not so fortunate.) Many of the big name music schools treat the incoming as if they are already professionals and don't really provide any thoughtful transition. Sure, during the time there you should be groomed and each year should be a tougher scene to prepare you for the real world. I don't know about you guys but at 18 I was not completely equipped to deal with the professional world. Do I blame these folks for their lack of involvement? NO - ultimately it was my problem and, in reality, no one really does have the responsibility to reach out or "get involved". Sure would have been a better experience if someone like my first teacher had been there to offer a bit of guidance instead of simply watching someone go through a period when they "fall down". This is not a problem unique to music schools. I know kids today who are getting NO meaningful feedback or guidance from advisors or faculty. Here at the U of MN I hear this complaint all the time. I wish I could offer a realistic solution to this problem and not just add to the whiny complaints, but considering the ingrained nature of the academic beast, I have no idea how it is every going to be allowed to change. I don't even know if "it" wants to. I guess the best we can do is try to make a difference personally. After all the saying says "change takes place at the individual level." Mike At 09:39 PM 1/21/00 , you wrote: >I know I am late responding to this thread, however it is possible that we can put some of the blame where the blame is due. Ever year, hundreds of Universities across the country accept mediocre students from mediocre high school programs as 'performance majors' on their applied instrument. Why? I know if I was a music professor, and My tenure relied on my ability to recruit players to justify my existence, then there are going to be players accepted that are less than good. A listing today for a trombone vacancy on the list states: > > >Rank and Salary--Associate Professor (tenured) or Assistant Professor (tenure >track), rank and salary commensurate with qualifications and experience. > >Qualifications--Master's degree or appropriate professional equivalent >required; prior experience in teaching at the college level; professional >experience as performer; ability and commitment to recruit and attract >exceptional trombone students. > > > >Notice the part about recruiting players...? > >Here's how the whole thing happens (did it happen to you?) > >First, the school will hire someone with a doctorate. > >Second, The candidate with a doctorate probably stayed in school because he couldn't get a gig to support theirself. Remember, those who can, do, and those that can't, teach (not always :} ) > >Third, the new teacher will fill up his studio with sub-par students to keep his numbers up, and impress administration. > >Fourth, The teacher will do his best to make players out of them. > >Fifth, He will fail most of the time, but send his students off with B.M degrees, nice comments about their student recital, and false hopes about their chances to play for a living. > >Sixth, they send a tape to BSO. > >Seventh, The mediocre player will then: cash it in and manage a Denny's; go back to school, and get THEIR Ph.D.; or join a military band. > >This happens thousands of times a year, and it destroy the integrity of the profession, drives down casual pay for gigs, and commits fraud worth millions of dollars on players who should be told - "Work harder, study more, and try again next year..." > >There are some absolutely great programs that consistently churns out great students, and great teachers that give their time to cultivating excellence in the profession. But, are there jobs in the economy for this many players? No! The US regulates the number of doctors (which we need more of) and Lawyers (which we need less of), but not the most valued members in society - trombonists! > >BTW - I don't know about other countries, But Germany only allowed 8 new trombone students in their university programs Nationwide, and I know some great players who have struggled for years to get in. Keeps the market in control, and makes the degree worth something, eh? > >Eric Burger >US Army Band, Heidelberg > From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:17 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 12:42:28 EST From: Trmbman@aol.com To: weslanke@worldnet.att.net, trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: recital Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit You might want to look at the Telemann Sonata in F minor. It is a great piece, with a great final movement Trombone and Euphonium Player Visit my Webpage at Http://Wactrm.tripod.com or contact me at Trmbman@aol.com From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:17 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 12:02:49 -0600 From: "Marple, Richard L COL BAMC-Ft Sam Houston" To: "'JennWhaa@aol.com'" , "Trombones and related issues forum." , Subject: RE: Random question from Trombone List Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Jen: Tom Coyle has a web page that highlights a number of Australian trombone players. Check him out. I didn't keep the bookmark so maybe Tom could send it to both of us. Tom Coyle [ata@powerup.com.au] Rick Marple San Antonio TX -----Original Message----- From: JennWhaa@aol.com [mailto:JennWhaa@aol.com] Sent: Thursday, January 20, 2000 8:25 PM To: Trombones and related issues forum. Subject: Random question Hi. This may seem like a random question but.... Does anyone know of any great trombonists in Australia? I never hear much about "down under". Jen From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:17 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 14:48:24 -0600 From: "Marple, Richard L COL BAMC-Ft Sam Houston" To: "'JennWhaa@aol.com'" , "'Trombone-L'" Subject: RE: Random question Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Jen: After a little research, Tom Coyle runs the Australian Trombone Association web page at http://www.powerup.com.au/~ata/ . PS he told me some time back that Warwick Tyrrell is not actively playing the trombone right now. Rick Marple San Antonio TX -----Original Message----- From: JennWhaa@aol.com [mailto:JennWhaa@aol.com] Sent: Thursday, January 20, 2000 8:25 PM To: Trombones and related issues forum. Subject: Random question Hi. This may seem like a random question but.... Does anyone know of any great trombonists in Australia? I never hear much about "down under". Jen From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:17 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 16:52:09 -0500 From: richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL To: JennWhaa@aol.com, trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: RE: Help! I could be torturing you! Message-ID: <21E592FA8BA7D311B5B100062B001FE2082ED8@LEE2> Resending this note that I think applies directly: But, what kind of praise do you trust? Friends are usually too nice - I know I only comment on the good parts of a performance, even if I heard more than that. I only look for one kind of honest praise. Ask me back. There supposedly is a higher level. Ask me back and pay me. Still hoping. yours, tim richardson > -----Original Message----- > From: JennWhaa@aol.com [SMTP:JennWhaa@aol.com] > Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2000 4:51 PM > To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu > Subject: Help! I could be torturing you! > > > I freely admit that I am a victim of this whole PC, self-esteem thing. > Not only have I received fake praise from teachers but I have also > received it from my parents and friends, specifically in music. Don't get > me wrong, I can play my horn. This wasn't always the case and I am still > FAR from even thinking about making a tape for a BSO audition. But I > realize that many people give praise freely even when it is not deserved > either because they don't know any better (my parents) or they are > concerned about hurting my feelings (my friends). > > As a result, and this may be a bad thing, I have a really hard time > believing anything anyone tells me that is good and am much more likely to > believe criticism. I don't want to be part of the 99% that don't know how > badly they are playing. I am going to know exactly how horrible I am at > all times! :) > > So, this leaves me a bit mental..... > > Is there a term for "fear of compliments"?? > > Jen From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:17 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 17:16:02 EST From: Servo149@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: just a test Message-ID: <45.780dd5.25bb8622@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit test From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:17 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 14:21:11 -0800 From: "Joe L. Norcross" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Goofing off (was Re: I was tortured....) Message-ID: <009e01bf6526$fe164c20$04000005@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The COS College Community band will allow students not in High School to play, With the approval of the director and there school band director. Most of these kids either come with a parent or their director. If they goof off they are gone ______________________________________ Joe L. Norcross Tuba, Sequoia Winds, Visalia British Brass Band Tuba and Announcer, Kingsburg City Band joetuba@lightspeed.net -----Original Message----- From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:17 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 18:33:48 -0500 From: "Stephen Hunt" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Help! I could be torturing you! (again too lengthy) Message-ID: <00d401bf6531$270057c0$0dbb463f@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is a step in the right direction. Ultimately, though, self esteem has almost nothing to do with praise and criticism (although this is less true for unwarranted and immature brow-beating). Self esteem really comes most from a proper sense of one's abilities where one fits in everything. I know many trombone players (myself included) who are relatively poor players but understand that this will not comdemn their souls. The very top players (or top in any field) share this same mentality. Since Doug Yeo started this thread and he is a very good player, I'll use him as an example. Suppose that I am practicing a part for performance in my college windband. I am able to improve that part because my mind is focussed on what I am doing and not occupied by outside issues. If Doug is practicing a part for his orchestra, he must avoid those same outside issues. Of course, unlike Doug, I have the added luxury of knowing that my trombone performance has a minimal effect on my livelihood, but the same attitude must be present for each of us to improve. How can children play basketball in their driveways for hours, all-the-while working on fundamental aspects of basketball as if their lives depend on it? They see it as a game. Many of the best trombone players (or anything else) take this perspective to practice. Yes, music is more than a game, but that is the proper attitude to proper practice. It's a simple matter of goal identification and choosing the best way to improve. What does this have to do with self esteem? Simple, nothing. The people with the healthiest self esteem understand that most things they do have nothing to do with their self worth. If I were suddenly unable to play trombone tomorrow, it wouldn't make me a lesser person. Conversly, if I woke up tomorrow a virtuoso, I wouldn't be a better person. That's the basis for my self esteem. Whatever I do that is not a spiritual matter (religion, family how I treat other people, matters of the soul) I do almost entirely for my own purposes and how well I do those things has no effect on who I am. My amount of effort and the discipline involved may help me spiritually, but that's another matter. Now, my final point, having to do with desperate self esteem perserverance. The best way to build a child's self esteem is to treat them respecfully and with common sense. This involves praising them for improvement and criticizing their faults without making them out to be less of a human being. Correcting misspelled words teaches children good spelling. Praising improvement in the spelling teaches them that discipline, effort, and improvement are good things. Neither of these things have to do with the child's self worth--they have to do with spelling. To build good self esteem, you remind them that they are good and worthwhile and that you are happy they are alive without attaching any of that to their performance in anything. It is just a simple truth. A proper balance among those three things will develop some people who are good writers, some people who are good musicians, some people who are good scientists, and an awful lot of people who are just good. That is the most important thing. Ignoring mistakes and extreme personal criticism fail in both self esteem development and teaching for the same reason--they attach self worth to an academic act or skill. Letting a children make mistakes without rebuke fails to prepare them for construcive criticism. Later, any instance of criticism is seen as a personal attack. Thus, the children grow up to believe that the world hates them because they can do nothing right. To them, the personal attacks are far too common for anything else to be true. They don't have the proper perspective. The same happens to children that are judged too harshly for their music or schoolwork or whatever. They think that their failures in that thing cause everyone to hate them. The fact of the matter is that no one's trombone playing is good enough to get them to heaven and children shouldn't be taught to think that much of their music. If they make it out into the world OK, then we can get good results from expecting adults to deal with adult criticisms, because they'll take the criticism and improve without having to sulk about it first. Self esteem is just a matter of the proper perspective. Stephen Hunt (looking to take my place as the world's most long-winded trombone player) From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:17 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 18:31:50 -0600 From: daboneman To: eang18@pacific.net.sg Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Bach Thayer Message-ID: <388A4BF6.B11C7FA6@mciworld.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I was just at the International Association of Jazz Educators conference and Bach had the 42T and 50T. They are very much still in production... the Bach horns have the actual O.E. Thayers, not their own make of one. The only problem is that there is a 1-3 year wait to get one. Dean McCarty freelance trombonist, Houston area Eric wrote: > Vincent Bach has already stopped its production of Thayer Valve > trombones, i think its because they lose the patent or sometning... i > need to update too.... From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:17 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 00 16:33:45 -0700 From: John Capon To: "Adolphus Sprott" , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: recital Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Adolphus, Are you a resident of the U.S. of A.? If so, why not do something truly American - and something easy on your chops - if you have any left to play the fifth piece. How about inviting a rhythm section to join you for a little jazz music at the end? Play some blues or a nice jazz standard in the middle register with a bit blowing (improv) in the mix by you and/or the other players. John John Capon Music Director, Malaspina Choir Artistic Director, Summer Jazz Academy Brass Instructor, Malaspina University/College Leader, John Capon Quartet Music Director, Gabriola Chamber Players R.R. 1, Site 3, C14 Gabriola, BC, Canada V0R 1X0 phone: 250 247 8531 http://www.islandnet.com/~bigbird/ My new CD - "Full Circle"is now available at Brad Howland's site http://www.musicforbrass.com/index.html Email: bigbird@islandnet.com fax: 250 247 9357 (please phone 250 247 8531 first to make sure fax is on) From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:17 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 17:51:55 -0800 From: Chris Tune To: slide.rule@adios.co.uk, "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Playing too fast Message-ID: <002401bf6544$6e5f8b00$42d9aace@ultrascsi> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit It is easy to gloss over the importance of playing a fast passage using these so-called "alternate" positions. The primary technical difference between Watrous and Rosolino like technically gifted players and the more pedestrian trombone players lies in the use of these positions and complete familiarity with their location. Eventually a lick choice like this should become pretty automatic. Of course in the beginning this is anything but "obvious". The rule about slide technique is two fold: Try to move the slide back and forth (and in general) as little as possible. When playing fast passages where you have succeeded in minimizing the motion of the slide, then move with as little jerkiness and as smoothly as possible. When playing slower passages err on the side of choosing shorter positions (such as 1st, 2nd and 3rd) and move the slide quickly from position to position to minimize any possibility of glissing from note to note. Gb Arpeggio: Although the 5th, 5th, 6th, 5th choice is pretty good (actually WAAAAY better than the first choice which, would in fact, produce better overall tone quality, if the passage were rather slow). The second choice mentioned has a particular benefit that should be mentioned: It involves slide movement all in one direction, in this case inward, toward your nose. First you are in 5th, then 5th then 3rd and then sharp 3rd positions. Generally a position choice like this, where the slide moves all in one direction produces the smoothest overall movement of the slide. This introduces the minimum mechanical disturbance through the horn up into the embouchure and therefore produces the quickest execution ability. This is true once you have practiced the passage sufficiently. Now, the exact choice of positions may depend upon what follows. If the next note is a high Bb, then this movement is perfect because you are heading up toward first position. If the next note is out in fifth or in fourth, then the other 5th, 5th, 6th, 5th, choice is pretty good looking! Whichever position set you choose, don't give up after only a few tries. At first this may not sound quite in tune, particularly if you don't make the right amount of movement from 3rd to sharp 3rd position. The Bb in 5th position may not sound too great at first (it may need to be played a little sharper than the Gb). After some familiarity and practice the passage should come out pretty well. Good luck and keep thinking about those "alternate" (maybe someday I'll call them something else, since they are so darned important!) positions. Christopher R. Tune http://www.christune.com Cell (818) 468-4767 Home (818) 763-9397 ********************************************* There are just two rules in life: 1. Don't tell people everything you know. ********************************************* ----- Original Message ----- From: Adrian Drover To: Trombones and related issues forum. Sent: Saturday, January 22, 2000 12:07 AM Subject: Re: Playing too fast > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: Trombones and related issues forum. > Sent: Friday, January 21, 2000 9:30 PM > Subject: Re: Playing too fast > > > Re: > > > >I have a 16 notes in a run and I have to > > >hit positions 5 1 3 5 for an rising arpeggio for a Gb Bb Eb Gb run of > > notes. > > > You don't mention in which octave this arpeggio appears, but if it's > from > > 4th partial Gb (Gb an augmented 4th below middle C), you can play the > arpeggio > > with almost NO slide motion by playing the Bb in 5th, the Eb in # 6th, and > the > > Gb in 5th. (Or, Gb in 5th, Bb in 5th, Eb in 3rd, Gb in # 3rd.) > > > > If it's an octave lower, you're out of luck as far as positions are > > concerned unless you have an F trigger which will allow you to play the Bb > in > > trigger 3rd. > > And if you have a Gb trigger, you can play the whole thing in 1st, 'cept the > 7th harmonic Eb is rather flat. Not recommended. > > A. > > Adrian Drover (ADIOS Scotland) > Personal: adrian@adios.co.uk > Business: studio@adios.co.uk > http://www.adios.co.uk > > From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:18 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 18:23:13 -0800 From: Chris Tune To: MAIN_BRADLEY_W@Lilly.com, "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Home Studio--Microphones and digital recording equipment Message-ID: <003401bf6548$d1532100$42d9aace@ultrascsi> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I have been able to get pretty good results by paying attention to some classic recording principals while not running out and spending on each new trend that is taking the home recording world by storm. The single biggest improvement was the DMAN 2044. Any other audio card I had just didn't equal a decent real semi-pro digital card (I used Soundblaster AWE32 and Turtle Beach Daytona PCI--this is infinitely better) My setup equipment: Audio Technica ATM 31 mic (a condenser mic, uses "back electret" design) Tascam 312B recording console (older console from the 1970's or early 80's--twelve channel 8bus) Midiman DMAN 2044 digital recording interface (four in and four out-20 bit AD/DA converters records up to 48khz at 16 bit resolution--this product line now called M-Audio) Cubase Score updated to ver 3.7 (this adds ASIO ver 2 and the dynamics processing such as compressor, gate, etc.) PC 200mhz, with 2gig SCSI drive and 8gig EIDE drive (where the audio files are recorded) Outboard gear: DBX 160xt compressor/limiter Alesis Midiverb IV stereo reverb and multieffect unit I try to keep levels as hot as I can but of course avoid clipping without fail (it sounds terrible in digital). I try to balance out the gain in each stage of the mixing console. This should minimize the amount of hiss added to the signal. I monitor using phones while recording (occasionally I can hear leakage. . .it usually isn't too significant, nor is PC equipment noise. . .I am aware of it and would seek to limit it if doing a lot of tracks). I usually do no more than four tracks of trombone. I use a boom to keep the mic up over my horn and stand. I find that two feet is about a good distance. I have gotten good results at three feet as well and have recorded vocals at closer distances (about 6in to 8in). But the boom is important. Somehow coming in from a couple of feet above the source produces noticeably better results. I record in an acoustically "dry" room. Essentially this room is a library or office with hundreds of books lining many shelves. There are always carpets on the floor. If I am really worried about the PC fan noise, I will cover it up with some towels or a carpet, taking them off, in between takes when I am going to have to fuss a bit. Once I record a track on to Cubase, I "normalize" the audio level on the track. This effectively produces an effect like hard limiting the top of the tracks level (some audio people out there will notice that this really, really, isn't true, but this is similar in a practical, rough way. It moves the level up without overloading the track) Only rarely will I limit the input to avoid overloading the track. The signal to noise ratio in digital is really quite a bit better than in analog so I prefer to simply leave as much out of the signal chain as I can and bring the level up using normalization. I find this introduces less noise (ultimately the digital recording equipment will faithfully record the Midiverb and 160xt noise even though it may be very small). Once I have normalized the tracks, I begin to determine how good of a "print" I've gotten. If it is really good, I will not use any EQ or Cubase internal compression. I will generally have to add back some reverb to the end mix, however. The room is simply too dry to give the effect of a "concert". In cubase I find I use the "Wunderverb" more than the other plug ins. It simply sounds better and all I am looking for is a little "hall" reverb. Mixing: I've printed up a final mix in Cubase which is in essence a WAV file of the final settings used for the various tracks. If I have a synth track accompanying my trombone I record an audio track version of the synth track (I did this for a "guitar" backing for my Ave Maria track). Then when I have the WAV file I turn it into an MP3 file using MusicMatch Jukebox. You can probably find this software by going to MP3.com and looking at their links over to players and "rippers". I don't burn CDs yet, since I haven't ponied up for a CD-RW unit. With good units coming in around 300, I will probably get one in the near term, though. Hope this helps and good luck with your recording. Christopher R. Tune http://www.christune.com Cell (818) 468-4767 Home (818) 763-9397 ********************************************* There are just two rules in life: 1. Don't tell people everything you know. ********************************************* ----- Original Message ----- From: Bradley W Main To: Trombones and related issues forum. Sent: Friday, January 21, 2000 7:38 AM Subject: Home Studio--Microphones and digital recording equipment > > > The very interesting thread on the tapes submitted to the BSO have prompted a > number of questions that I thought I would solicit the opinions of the listers > who have home studios. > > If you are in the habit of laying down digital tracks directly onto a computer > hard drive, What equipment and techniques are you using to get high quality > recordings? > > Specifically: > Microphone(s) > Distance to the mic > Preamps > Controllers > Samplers > Sequencing software > Mixers > Other? > > > Do you then go directly to CD, or do you come back to DAT or what?? > > Thanks, > Brad > > From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:18 2000 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 20:46:11 -0700 From: Delbert Pakiser To: yardleys@prodigy.net Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: is there hope for me? Message-ID: <388A7983.3995EC95@ecentral.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello James, You have asked a great question and there have been many great guidelines for you to follow. One idea you might want to consider. Prepare for two to four different careers. Most all of the senior members of this list have worked in two or three different careers in their lifetime. It is very difficult to find a retired person who did only one job exactly the same for his or her entire working years. There will be opportunities ten years into the future that we can't even dream of at this time. Get the best broadbased foundational education that you can so you will be ready for all the changes in the future. However, do keep your dreams and desires alive. Del Pakiser Bass Trombonist > James Yardley wrote: > > Dear List, > > First of all, I would like to thank everyone for all the wonderful > knowledge I've gained from sitting here at this poor excuse for a > computer. A lot of the posts I've read have been very inspirational > for me. Just to give a little background on myself, my name is James > Yardley. I live in Duluth, MN where I play Bass Trombone at my high > school. I am a senior this year, and I plan on continuing my study of > music. Right now, I am leaning towards Music Education. What I would > love to do, however, is play my Bass Trombone in a major symphony. I > feel like I'm a rope and "reality" and "my hopes and dreams" are > playing tug of war with me. As of now, I plan on attending UW-Eau > Claire. I have my audtion on Feb. 12th. After reading the recent > posts, I've realized how badly I actually want to be a performer, > instead of band director. I'm just hoping for a push in the right > direction from a true professional out there. I come from a not so > wealthy family who can't afford to send me to a major music school. > And I don't own my own instrument yet. I know that there are jobs out > there for music teachers. I spend the majority of my school day in > the band room with my wonderful band director. Here is what has been > going through my head. If I go to college, and get a degree in Music > Education, I can get a job and live a comfortable life. Or, I can > risk it all, work my butt off, and HOPEFULLY audition into a good > orchestra. I WANT TO BE A PERFORMER. But is this truly possible for > a high school senior, going to UW-Eau Claire (actually a pretty good > music school)? I really need some words of inspiration from someone > that may know what I'm going through. Not that this makes any > difference, but I did audition into the All-State Orchestra, and I've > received a few awards at high school band festivals for my playing. > I'm not a child prodigy or anything, but I do have a good work ethic > and it shows in my playing. Please shed some light this situation for > me!!! > > James Yardley > Bass Trombone From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:18 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 00:33:33 -0500 From: Dave Burch To: Adolphus Sprott Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: recital Message-ID: <388A92AD.F6505889@fuse.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit How about the Eric Ewazen sonata for tenor trombone? If you don't want to play a whole sonata -- you already have a couple of concerti on the program -- then just the last movement ("allegro giocoso") would make an upbeat, audience-pleasing finish to your evening. It's not terribly hard to play, but sounds impressive, and ends big and bright. The range is modest, low E to high B. Needs a pretty good pianist -- if you have one, you'll have fun together, because the piano and trombone play tightly together in several spots, making some beautiful sonorities. The piano makes like church bells celebrating the 4th of July at the end, while the trombone makes like a trombone. 8^) Adolphus Sprott wrote: > > I am a high school player and I will be putting on a recital in a few > months. I have decided that I want to play five pieces. I have already > chosen four of them, but I can't think of a good closer. So far, my program > is: > > 1. Concerto-Korsakov > 2. Manipulations-Molineaux > 3. Concerto No. 2-V. Blazhevich > 4. Morceau Symphonique-Guilmant > 5. ????????? > > I need some ideas on a good closing piece that will be enjoyable for the > audience and won't take me a million years to master (please don't suggest > Blue Bells, I have been there, done that, and failed miserably). I'm > looking for something with a quick tempo and reasonable range (not above > high d). Since this will be my last piece, I am assuming in advance that my > chops will be rather tired. Thanks in advance for the help. -- @%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@ ------ Dave Burch ------ ---- Hamilton, Ohio ----- -- daveburch@fuse.net -- Church and community trombonist, baritone hornist, recorderist, choral singer After Hours Big Band Cincinnati Brass Band at http://cincinnati.brassband.com Hamilton-Fairfield Symphony Chorale (and sometimes Orchestra) at http://www.hfso.org Senior programmer/analyst, Mercy Health Partners @%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@ From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:18 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 00:45:20 -0500 From: Dave Burch To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Mutes to fit pea shooters and cannons Message-ID: <388A9570.42705B12@fuse.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, all. It probably is time for me to get some decent tenor trombone mutes, at least a straight and cup. I have a big Edwards and a little King 2B. If I get just one good straight and cup (Jo-Ral, Tom Crown, Denis Wick, or such), can I expect them to work well with both trombones? Also, does anyone have reasons to prefer aluminum, brass-end, or copper-end mutes? Thanks. -- @%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@ ------ Dave Burch ------ ---- Hamilton, Ohio ----- -- daveburch@fuse.net -- Church and community trombonist, baritone hornist, recorderist, choral singer After Hours Big Band Cincinnati Brass Band at http://cincinnati.brassband.com Hamilton-Fairfield Symphony Chorale (and sometimes Orchestra) at http://www.hfso.org Senior programmer/analyst, Mercy Health Partners @%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@%@ From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:18 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 00:26:01 -0600 From: "Robert Holland" To: "Trb. List" Subject: Re: College, Money, and Torture Message-ID: <200001230528.2106000@mail.chicagonet.net> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Eric Burger wrote: > I know I am late responding to this thread, however it is possible that we > can put some of the blame where the blame is due. Ever year, hundreds of > Universities across the country accept mediocre students from mediocre high > school programs as 'performance majors' on their applied instrument. Why? This argument comes up every so often. It's partly true, but the characterization is dangerously wrong, IMO. > Here's how the whole thing happens (did it happen to you?) > > First, the school will hire someone with a doctorate. If there's any field where the doctoral degree is more routinely ignored, I sure don't know where. With respect to academia, we often complain that terminal degrees are window dressing for those unable to better evaluate a candidate; and in the same breath we deride holders of terminal degrees as incompetent (see paragraph below). It's more complicated than either of those views allows. > Second, The candidate with a doctorate probably stayed in school because he > couldn't get a gig to support theirself. Remember, those who can, do, and > those that can't, teach (not always :} ) There are degrees that connote acheivement and those that don't. It's an individual thing needing careful evaluation. Garbage cliches such as that above don't help anyone to figure out which is which. > Third, the new teacher will fill up his studio with sub-par students to > keep his numbers up, and impress administration. So what's new? Why bite the hand that feeds? Individuals climbing corporate hierarchies are notorious for making choices that are damaging in every way except for their own career prospects. Appearance overrides results. It's part of human nature, and it's part of a complicated set of contradictory incentives we've built up around ourselves in modern life. > Fourth, The teacher will do his best to make players out of them. > > Fifth, He will fail most of the time, but send his students off with B.M > degrees, nice comments about their student recital, and false hopes about > their chances to play for a living. Well, that's about the most cynical thing I've ever seen. Sure, there are slimeballs out there. But let's not paint so broadly with that brush that we stigmatize anyone charged with marshalling a student through the educational process. Good result are not merely a result of luck, nor or natural ability. > Sixth, they send a tape to BSO. As well they should. It's a learning process on both sides, though not necessarily a happy one. People are discouraged from auditioning, the committee determines who they really want to hear. If there were a better process for uncovering the best candidates, I suspect we would have discovered or created it by now. > Seventh, The mediocre player will then: cash it in and manage a Denny's; go > back to school, and get THEIR Ph.D.; or join a military band. More awful cynicism. I won't comment further. > This happens thousands of times a year, and it destroy the integrity of the > profession, drives down casual pay for gigs, and commits fraud worth > millions of dollars on players who should be told - "Work harder, study > more, and try again next year..." > > There are some absolutely great programs that consistently churns out great > students, and great teachers that give their time to cultivating excellence > in the profession. But, are there jobs in the economy for this many > players? No! The US regulates the It's partly a product of supply and demand. There's a terrific demand for musical education. People are willing to pay for it. Colleges make money by offering it. Refusing to satisfy that demand doesn't make any sense. Past the point of graduation, it's true that the demand for college-educated musicians doesn't begin to approximate the supply -- no matter the quality of that supply. Sure, it's out of balance. You want colleges and universities to refuse to make money so that those who remain to offer music degrees can get a better placement rate? Nice dream. > BTW - I don't know about other countries, But Germany only allowed 8 new > trombone students in their university programs Nationwide, and I know some > great players who have struggled for years to get in. Keeps the market in > control, and makes the degree worth something, eh? Isn't it also true that there are a lot of regional and spa orchestras and opera houses in Germany that can't find decent players because the supply is so low? Many of the folks playing in those groups would be in the group refused in the tape round in the U.S. Why is it so skewed against people in the U.S. and for people in Germany? I dunno. It's imbalanced both places. I can promise, too, that there is more than a handful of absolutely terrific players in the U.S. without full-time gigs. That doesn't invalidate their effort or achievement -- no more than a gig confers upon some of the incompetent folks employed out there any extra respect. Disclaimer: I'm arguing with the content of the message quoted, not the person. My answer may seem harsh to some, but it's because I believe the debate to be badly imbalanced and too reductive. Robert Holland Briar Music Press briar@chicagonet.net http://members.aol.com/EnsPub/briar.htm From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:18 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 08:54:05 EST From: Neobopr@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: web page Message-ID: <17.d9d75a.25bc61fd@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello all, I've made a bunch more changes, making my page more readable and adding some special services, a free clinic special and a new business phone number. Check it out! Yamaha Artist/Clinician-Jeff Adams From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:19 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 11:23:49 -0500 (EST) From: Beth Lewis To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: TEST Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:19 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 12:00:34 -0500 From: "Denver D. Seifried" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Slide Hampton Concert Message-ID: <002001bf65c3$6b392b00$23735acf@dscomp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001C_01BF6599.7468F360"
Just wanted to relay to the list what a great trombone experience I had Saturday evening listening and performing with Slide Hampton. Slide came to Dayton, Saturday, to perform with the Dayton Jazz Orchestra, as part of our Jazz Composers Series. The last time I had heard Slide,live, was back in the early 1970's, when he was at the ITA Workshop at George Peabody College, in Nashville. Last evening, it was another one of those great experiences in my trombone playing career. Slide still is one of the great players! Great ideas, super technique, mellow sound, and a great gentleman! What more could you ask for?
 
I hope the younger players on the list and those of you who have not heard Slide, will be able to hear him play. He is definitely one of the great icons of jazz trombone playing (and arranging).
 
Denny Seifried
Bass Trombone-Dayton Jazz Orchestra
 From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:19 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 19:46:59 +0100 From: "b.v.dijk" To: "trblists" Subject: Rotterdam Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear friends, On my site you can find new information about our Conservatory in Rotterdam. There is some new text and pictures of the teachers. For those interested in a new style of studying trombone this is the place to be. Jazz and Classical trombone playing are really intergrated in each other. If you have questions, please mail me. Greetings Ben Bass Trombone Rotterdam Philharmonic http://people.a2000.nl/dijkbvan b.v.dijk@people.a2000.nl From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:19 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 15:18:43 -0500 From: "Paul D. Kemp, Jr." To: , "Wayne Dyess" , "Warren Woodruff" , Subject: My new website !!!!!!!!!! Message-ID: <002e01bf65df$16f91c00$8f5efc9e@volpaulbear> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_002B_01BF65B5.22A52F00"
Dear Friends,
    I have started a new website since this past Friday. Please Keep in mind that it is still under construction and I will be adding more things as I have time. Please feel free to tell me what you think and those of you who are in the trombone fraternity please let me know what you what like to see added to it, and I'll see what I can do. the URL is:
 
 
If any of you have done a website, you know that it is quite time consuming and I have put a great amount of time and thought into this. Constructive criticism is welcomed.
 
 
Paul Kemp
Chattanooga Symphony
 From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:19 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 12:30:07 -0800 From: "Joe L. Norcross" To: "Trombone" Subject: test Message-ID: <011901bf65e0$a4725820$04000005@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit test ______________________________________ Joe L. Norcross Tuba, Sequoia Winds, Visalia British Brass Band Tuba and Announcer, Kingsburg City Band joetuba@lightspeed.net From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:19 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 13:52:47 -0800 From: "Ellard" To: "Trombone List" Subject: Range Message-ID: <000701bf65ec$33ae2040$84b694d1@ellard> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF65A9.21E075E0"
Any suggestions as to how to extend one's range downwards on bass trombone.  I can get to pedal G without pivoting.
 
Rod
 From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:19 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 14:05:10 -0800 From: "Ellard" To: "Trombone List" Subject: To List Monitor Message-ID: <000901bf65ed$ec77ec40$2fb694d1@ellard> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0006_01BF65AA.DCB10E60"
I am not receiving any email from the list. Rod
 From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:19 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 16:08:18 -0600 From: "Kenneth Dowdy" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Cc: Subject: Test Message-ID: <000801bf65ee$5d208f60$af180f3f@default> Test. From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:19 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 16:23:56 -0600 From: daboneman To: Trombones and related issues forum Subject: Where's the list? Message-ID: <388B7F7B.C81288DF@mciworld.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Is the list off-line? From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:19 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 16:31:50 -0600 From: daboneman To: Trombones and related issues forum Subject: 2nd post...Is the list down? Message-ID: <388B8156.929894E5@mciworld.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I need my fix... From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:19 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 15:07:04 PST From: "Aaron Roth" To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Gräfe? Message-ID: <20000123230704.13101.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed List: I have received no posts today; instead of just sending a test, I thought I'd make my probe useful: Does anyone have the dates and the correct spelling of the name for Friedebald Gr‹fe? I have no idea how it's spelled, and an associate asked me about the dates since he's been having trouble locating the info. Thanks in advance. -Aaron Roth | /| | _ / | | ___________________/---/ | | / | | / __________________ | | / / _||_ || \---\_ | || / /King\ || \ | | \ \ \3B-F/ || \| | \ \__||______||_______________________________________ | \_________________________________________________<> \ | | | | | ___/ \ \ | |ø---- __|_|____|_|___________________________/ / | | }________________________________________/ | |_---- Pet Peeves: ATM Machine = automated teller machine machine PIN Number = personal identification number number HIV Virus = Human Immunodeficiency Virus Virus Rio Grande River = River Big River Sierra Nevada Mountains = Mountains Snowy Mountains (Mail suggestions to: ) ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:19 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 20:21:31 -0500 From: "John Lavoie" To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Anybody out there? Message-ID: <933600C39B1D3D11DA1D00807CFDCB89@webmaster.Trombonegod.zzn.com> Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I haven't gotten any posts in the last couple days. Have I gotten unsubscribed again? JOhn John Lavoie Sophomore, Ithaca College http://members.tripod.com/Trombone8vb http://members.tripod.com/Trombone8vb. I appologize for the following ad. ___________________________________________________________ Get your own Web-Based E-mail Service at http://www.zzn.com From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:19 2000 Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 23:22:20 EST From: Tbcwes@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: ? Message-ID: <4a.b5801f.25bd2d7c@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Have I been booted from the list, did I miss an important message, or has everyone said all that needs to be said? -Wes From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:19 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 05:57:07 -0500 From: "Brooke and Ryan Ringnalda" To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Test Message-ID: <200001241056.FAA27346@mail2.mco.bellsouth.net> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sorry, this is only a test. From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:19 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 04:57:33 -0500 From: Charles To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: instruments for sale Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.20000124095733.00685824@totcon.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Soprano Trombone (slide trumptet?) Beuscher - Silver- Circa 1910 - good - $200 Mellophone - Clarion - Gold lacquer (worn) - Circa 1950 - excellent - $200 Alto Horn - Holton - Gold Lacquer (worn) - Circa 1950 - excellent $200 Baritone/Euph - King - Gold Lacquer - Circa 1950's - good shape - $300 chardy@totcon.com From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:19 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 06:42:12 -0600 From: "Adolphus Sprott" To: "Trombone-L" Subject: test Message-ID: <001101bf6668$72dd4940$0ae0490c@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit please disregard this message From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:20 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 04:53:12 -0800 From: "Joe L. Norcross" To: "Trombone" Message-ID: <007201bf6669$fa0209a0$04000005@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit query? ______________________________________ Joe L. Norcross Tuba, Sequoia Winds, Visalia British Brass Band Tuba and Announcer, Kingsburg City Band joetuba@lightspeed.net From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:20 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 09:06:42 -0500 From: BrianB@PR-CN.COM To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: VPO in the News Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain I have been having email problems today, so my apologies if this has already been posted. MSNBC has an interesting (and long) article today: "Taking on the Vienna Philharmonic. Composer-Activist Plays the Internet for Women's Rights." The trombone related part of this is interviews with Abbie Conant and Monique Buzzarte. There also a few trumpet and trombone excerpts that you can listen to and vote on whether they are played by a man or a woman. http://www.msnbc.com/news/355820.asp Brian From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:20 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 08:26:46 -0600 From: "Michael Dugan" To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Crespo Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Does anyone know of any sheet music store that sells the Crespo Improvisation #1? Hickey's is not carrying it currently and I would like to avoid getting it straight from the publisher. Thanks, Mike Dugan From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:20 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 09:40:38 -0500 From: Douglas Yeo To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Recital closing piece Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" >In a message dated 1/22/00 12:20:42 AM Eastern Standard Time, weslanke@worldnet.att.net writes: > > I am a high school player and I will be putting on a recital in a few > months. I have decided that I want to play five pieces. I have already > chosen four of them, but I can't think of a good closer. So far, my program > is: > > 1. Concerto-Korsakov > 2. Manipulations-Molineaux > 3. Concerto No. 2-V. Blazhevich > 4. Morceau Symphonique-Guilmant > 5. ????????? > > I need some ideas on a good closing piece that will be enjoyable for the > audience and won't take me a million years to master How about a song? A Bach aria, one of the Vaughn Williams "Five Mystical Songs", a Mahler Song, a Faure Song, a Schubert or Schumann Lieder, a hymn arrangement. Something with a message you want your audience to go away with. Recitals don't have to end loud and fast and high. They CAN end with something contemplative which gives the audience something to think about, and gives you something to express that's meaningful to you. In recent years, I've taken to ending my recitals with something that ends quietly and contemplatively (my albums, too). Not only do I like doing it for ME, but the comments I get from audiences indicate that they appreciate it as well. The two things I most often play to end recitals are James Curnow's arrangement of "Amazing Grace" and "The Call" by Vaughn Williams (from his "Five Mystical Songs). Of course, it takes a different kind of player who will choose to play a beautiful song rather than Blue Bells. The "gee whiz" technique of many "closers" fails to impress most people any more - been there, done that, Lindberg did it faster, heard that, no big deal. But beautiful expression of a melody in a way that calls attention to the message rather than the player, well, that's something else. Then again, some things are obvious, others are sublime. -Doug Yeo ********************************************** * Douglas Yeo * * Bass Trombonist, Boston Symphony Orchestra * * Music Director, The New England Brass Band * * yeo@yeodoug.com * * http://www.yeodoug.com * * <>< * ********************************************** From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:20 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 09:43:56 -0500 From: richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL To: webmaster@Trombonegod.zzn.com, trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: RE: Virtual Lessons Message-ID: <21E592FA8BA7D311B5B100062B001FE2082EDD@LEE2> Whoa there!!!!!! Cryo is subtle???????? Guess I've been listening to different anecdotes than you. According to the believers, cryo isn't subtle, cryo makes tremendous improvements in all aspects of playing - high, low, loud, soft, etc. etc., such that non trombone players and even non musicians instantly notice your warmer AND more focused sound, without knowing you'd done anything different. ( little tongue in cheek here - but you know what new converts are like) If on the other hand cryo is subtle, MAYBE EVEN UNDETECTABLE , then we're arguing over nothing, aren't we? If it isn't detectable on MP3 or a microphone, it isn't there. Sorry. Notice I'm not claiming the mike picks up your "true" tone - but it ought to pick up some difference. hey, maybe cryo has an effect that is undetectible on MP3, or normal microphones, or normal ears. hmmmh? > -----Original Message----- > From: John Lavoie [SMTP:webmaster@Trombonegod.zzn.com] > Sent: Friday, January 21, 2000 10:28 AM > To: trombones.and.related.issues.forum." > "@po.missouri.edu > Subject: RE: Virtual Lessons > > That's a nice idea in theory, but I'd rather not have to listen to > 1800 MP3's every year. > > As for the cryo experiments, I doubt that the subtleties claimed > would actually come out in an MP3. Could most microphones even > record them? We've all heard the complaints about mics actually > being able to pick up a good trombone sound. > > JOhn Lavoie > > > From: richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL > > In fact, wouldn't it be fun to have thread > of the week, where one of us poor unsuspecting contributors would get > his/her excerpt cut to shreds by 900 gleeful listmembers? The other > is the > business of qualification for list membership. With the recent abuse > problem, maybe everyone needs to prove they actually own and play a > trombone, however badly. We should have a big web site in the sky, > with an > excerpt yearly from each list member, and once a year we would vote > on most > "improved." > > Hey, what about putting that cryo experiment up on MP3, and let 900 > of us > take a crack at seeing if we can hear any difference? > > yours, > tim richardson > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: David S Staines [SMTP:DAVE64322@prodigy.net] > > Sent: Thursday, January 20, 2000 11:36 PM > > To: Trombones and related issues forum. > > Subject: Virtual Lessons > > > > Just a thought... > > > > With today's technology, I was thinking that taking virtual lesson > would > > be > > a unique way to put busy trombone students in touch with busy > trombone > > teachers. A virtual lesson would involve a student preparing a wav > or MP3 > > file to be emailed to his or her teacher. The file is critiqued by > the > > teacher, and written comments returned to the student, along with > the next > > assignment, and maybe a demonstration MP3 or wav file done by the > teacher. > > There could be other exchanges to create a useful long distance > learning > > experience. > > > > I am not suggesting this path for the serious student, the ones > pursuing > > music as a career. But maybe for the weekend warrior, it would be a > nice > > way > > to squeeze a lesson in. Any comments for or agin? > > > > David Staines > > 2nd Trombone > > Bufalo Silver Band > > > > > > > > > > > > > > John Lavoie > Sophomore, Ithaca College > http://members.tripod.com/Trombone8vb > > > http://members.tripod.com/Trombone8vb. I appologize for the following > ad. > ___________________________________________________________ > Get your own Web-Based E-mail Service at http://www.zzn.com From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:20 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 08:42:46 -0600 From: Listmonitor Trombone-L To: Trombone-L Subject: REGARDING LIST OUTAGE Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" For unknown reasons, the list was down from approximately 10:00 p.m. Friday, 21 January, 2000 through approximately 8:20 a.m. Monday, 24 January, 2000. List service has been restored (I LOVE stating the obvious). Should you continute to have problems, please contact me via e-mail. LM --------------------------------------- trombone-l digest archives and useful trombone-l information are available at http://www.cjnetworks.com/~tsks From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:20 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 09:01:13 -0600 From: Listmonitor Trombone-L To: Trombone-L Subject: HTML in Posts Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Please DO NOT post using HTML in your messages. The bulk of the HTML-encoded e-mail is coming from individuals using Microsoft Outlook Express 5.0. Please adjust your settings to "Plain Text", rather than HTML. LM --------------------------------------- trombone-l digest archives and useful trombone-l information are available at http://www.cjnetworks.com/~tsks From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:20 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 09:15:27 -0600 From: "Guion, David" <8guion@jmls.edu> To: "Trombones and related issues forum." , "'Adolphus Sprott'" Subject: RE: recital Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain > Where can I find Atlantic Zephyrs by Gardell Simons? > And for that matter, where can you find "La Petite Suzanne"? A lot of old, classic solos have gone out of print. If they are still in print, of course, you can get them from Hickey's or Robert King (all the usual suspects). If they are out of print, well, anything published before 1922 or thereabouts is public domain, so photocopying is legal. You might check your local library to find a copy on interlibrary loan. I have looked at a number of suggestions, but I can't help thinking that the Guilmant is a fine closing piece. It allows for some real bravura playing and lets you show off a high c-sharp. Something tuneful and uncomplicated for a fourth piece might fill the bill. Someone suggested Stardust, which you can do with bass and guitar accompaniment instead of piano. If you have played in a small ensemble (and the other members are available), whatever piece you played will work well either as a fourth piece or as a closer. If you choose a piece with piano accompaniment, you may want to consider moving the Molineux from second to third. I think that your planning so far is very good, with a variety of styles and an unaccompanied piece in the mix. Good luck, and be sure to send a copy of your program to the ITA Journal. ^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ David Guion, Cataloger John Marshall Law School 315 S. Plymouth Ct. Chicago, IL 60604 Voice: (312) 427-2737 x 552 Fax; (312) 427-8307 "Outside of a dog, books are a man's best friend; inside of a dog, it's too dark to read"--Groucho Marx ^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ > ---------- > From: Adolphus Sprott[SMTP:weslanke@worldnet.att.net] > Reply To: Adolphus Sprott > Sent: Saturday, January 22, 2000 9:56 AM > To: Trombones and related issues forum. > Subject: recital > > From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:20 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 10:25:45 -0500 From: Douglas Yeo To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: David Orch Parts - B flat? Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain ; format="flowed" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I've had a query from someone who is looking for the orchestra parts to the David Concertino but in the bass trombone transcription in B flat major (as published by Zimmermann/Frankfurt, ed. Martin Gšss). Does such a set exist, and if so, where might it be obtained? Thanks in advance. -Doug Yeo ********************************************** * Douglas Yeo * * Bass Trombonist, Boston Symphony Orchestra * * Music Director, The New England Brass Band * * yeo@yeodoug.com * * http://www.yeodoug.com * * <>< * ********************************************** From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:20 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 09:26:26 -0600 From: "Guion, David" <8guion@jmls.edu> To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: Help! I could be torturing you! (again too lengthy) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain . . .Yes, music is more than a game, but that is the proper attitude to proper > practice. It's > a simple matter of goal identification and choosing the best way to > improve. > What does this have to do with self esteem? Simple, nothing. The people > with the > healthiest self esteem understand that most things they do have nothing to > do with > their self worth. . . > > Stephen Hunt > (looking to take my place as the world's most long-winded trombone player) > Great post, Stephen. Of course, if you're trying to set records for length, you failed miserably. :-) ^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ David Guion, Cataloger John Marshall Law School 315 S. Plymouth Ct. Chicago, IL 60604 Voice: (312) 427-2737 x 552 Fax; (312) 427-8307 "Outside of a dog, books are a man's best friend; inside of a dog, it's too dark to read"--Groucho Marx ^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:20 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 09:38:30 -0600 From: "Guion, David" <8guion@jmls.edu> To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: Grdfe? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Aaron Roth wrote > Does anyone have the dates and the correct spelling of the name for > Friedebald Gr‹fe? I have no idea how it's spelled, and an associate asked > > me about the dates since he's been having trouble locating the info. > I haven't been able to find it, either, and I have been looking for years. Graefe (you spelled it right, but I don't know how to make an umlaut in email) is one of the vast army of hard-core obscure composers that trombonists rely on for a big chunk of the repertoire. I'm afraid that dates will come up (if at all) only when someone is reading Allgemeine Musikalische Zeitung or similar old magazine and looking for something else. If I'm wrong about that, I sure hope someone posts to the list! ^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ David Guion, Cataloger John Marshall Law School 315 S. Plymouth Ct. Chicago, IL 60604 Voice: (312) 427-2737 x 552 Fax; (312) 427-8307 "Outside of a dog, books are a man's best friend; inside of a dog, it's too dark to read"--Groucho Marx ^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:20 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 10:56:07 -0500 From: "Chuck De Paolo" To: "Trombone-L" Subject: Re: David Orch Parts - B flat? Message-ID: <00b201bf6683$86f75bd0$0200a8c0@ws2> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit The only company that publishes a piano reduction in Bb is Zimmermann of Frankfurt, Germany (Kagarice does one for bass trombone in Bb also, but it is for brass choir accompaniment only). Looking through the Zimmermann catalog, I see no reference to orchestral material for sale or hire. This is no surprise, as I think the Goess arrangement was made soley to satisfy the demand for a recital piece for bass trombonists. Creating an arrangement for full orchestra would be interesting. The distance between the original and transposed key, a perfect fourth down, is so far apart that voicing of the strings and winds would have to be completely re-thought and re-written throughout the entire work. Sounds like fun, but I'm a little busy these days! ----- Original Message ----- From: Douglas Yeo To: Trombones and related issues forum. Sent: Monday, January 24, 2000 10:25 AM Subject: David Orch Parts - B flat? I've had a query from someone who is looking for the orchestra parts to the David Concertino but in the bass trombone transcription in B flat major (as published by Zimmermann/Frankfurt, ed. Martin Gšss). Does such a set exist, and if so, where might it be obtained? Thanks in advance. -Doug Yeo ********************************************** * Douglas Yeo * * Bass Trombonist, Boston Symphony Orchestra * * Music Director, The New England Brass Band * * yeo@yeodoug.com * * http://www.yeodoug.com * * <>< * ********************************************** From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:20 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 10:54:38 -0500 From: sabutin@mindspring.com To: ellard@sprint.ca Cc: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Range Message-ID: <200001241556.KAA04374@smtp10.atl.mindspring.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit At 01:52 PM 1/23/00 -0800, you wrote: > > Any suggestions as to how to extend one's range downwards on bass trombone.Ê > I can get to pedal G without pivoting. > Ê > Rod > > ================================== Rod... That's a short, concise question...but the possible answers could take pages. Two suggestions from me... 1-Go to the two articles I wrote on the Online Trombone Journal about embouchure: http://www.trombone.org/articles/library/outofthecase5-1.asp http://www.trombone.org/articles/library/outofthecase5-2.asp and apply those techniques to your pedal range and sub pedal range. 2-Find a set of Phil Teele's bass trombone exercises and do them religiously for at least a few weeks...especially the long tone one. Later... S. From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:21 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 10:13:58 -0600 (CST) From: Donn Schaefer To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Cultivating a Positive Studio Attitude, Revisited Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Last year we discussed things a new college teacher can do to cultivate a positive studio attitude. Specifically, I was a new teacher in a temporary position who was replacing a monster player. I'm happy to report that changing a studio attitude for the better can be done. It does take time. The thing which had the greatest effect on the studio was getting some new young players who practice. They were told that sitting around in the lounge would only perpetuate mediocrity. Once they were in the practice rooms, they began chasing at the heels of older players who didn't see a need to work very hard. Overall, students are now practicing harder. They are also discovering that their performances are sounding better. We still have things to work on, but it has been exciting to see a change in work ethic and attitude in only one year. Donn Schaefer Instructor of Low Brass Middle Tennessee State University From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:21 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 08:28:11 PST From: "Daniel Pliskin" To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Monday and getting quite high on a morning mate. Message-ID: <20000124162811.4621.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Doug, Iâd like to address this to you and the list. First, thank you for sending along that helpfull note, last week. You know, the one where you simply stated that if anyone wanted to play with a major orchestra, they should probably send in a good audition tape of themselves. It should sound good, for example, and it should be in tune. I suppose itâs kind of like running spell check, before sending an E-mail, so that your spelling doesnât let on what a buffoon you are. This blasted computer doesnât have one, however, but I do understand the concept. Iâd also like to thank you for a few comments where you attempted to steer us towards making beautiful music, rather than aiming for the loud and fast. And lastly, Iâd like to suggest that the reason you (Doug) sound so good is because he simply leaves his horn in the trunk of his car, at night. That way, he gets (no, actually his horn gets) free Cryo treatments, up there in Boston. I KNOW that after I have my horn cryo treated, my intonation will be perfect, my embouchure will be flawless and I will suddenly have supurb musical taste. Isn't that right? Perhaps, if you were to mention what the weather was like, in your posts, you wouldnât get so many of those horrid audition tapes. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:21 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 10:38:56 -0600 From: Mike Coyle To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: ? Message-ID: <200001241639.KAA25497@newton.pconline.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 10:22 PM 1/23/00 , you wrote: >Have I been booted from the list, did I miss an important message, or has >everyone said all that needs to be said? > >-Wes I was pretty sure it was the latter until this morning when I got 60 emails. I still think everyone has said all that needs to be said, but that has never stopped people from perfecting the fine art of redundancy ;-) mc From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:21 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 09:58:58 MST From: Dennis Clason To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: College, Money, and Torture Message-ID: <200001241659.JAA135594@nestor.NMSU.Edu> Addressed to: briar@chicagonet.net trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu ** Reply to note from Robert Holland 01/23/00 12:26am -0600 > I can promise, too, that there is more than a handful of absolutely > terrific players in the U.S. without full-time gigs. That doesn't > invalidate their effort or achievement -- no more than a gig confers > upon some of the incompetent folks employed out there any extra respect. > > Disclaimer: I'm arguing with the content of the message quoted, not the > person. My answer may seem harsh to some, but it's because I believe the > debate to be badly imbalanced and too reductive. I want to second your response, and a question of my own. At what point did our Universities become trade schools? I personally don't see the University to have any necessary role in training anyone for a job. The role of undergraduate education is to teach the student how to learn, and especially how to teach themselves. Those things are best taught through a medium that the student likes -- it might be music or mathematics, physics or philosophy. There is time to specialize later, if that's what you want to do. Or, as Socrates put it: hand him a gold coin and send him away if he feels he must profit from all knowledge. Dennis -- Dennis L. Clason email: dclason@nmsu.edu Department of Economics / University Statistics Center New Mexico State University Las Cruces, New Mexico USA From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:21 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 10:58:51 -0600 From: Chris Waage To: Trombone-L , brass@quartz.gly.fsu.edu Subject: OTJ Classifieds Update Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" The Online Trombone Journal Classifieds (http://www.trombone.org/classifieds) have been updated as of 10:57 a.m. CST on January 24, 2000 with over 18 new listings. OTJ Instrument Classifieds http://www.trombone.org/classifieds/instruments.asp OTJ Accessory Classifieds http://www.trombone.org/classifieds/accessories.asp OTJ Music Classifieds http://www.trombone.org/classifieds/music.asp To place an ad: http://www.trombone.org/classifieds/adform.asp If you have any questions or comments about the Online Trombone Journal Classifieds, please contact me at chris@trombone.org. Chris _________________________________________ Chris Waage chris@trombone.org Associate Webmaster The Online Trombone Journal http://www.trombone.org From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:21 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 11:15:09 -0600 From: Mike Coyle To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: College, Money, and Torture Message-ID: <200001241715.LAA30211@newton.pconline.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" from Robert Holland >> I can promise, too, that there is more than a handful of absolutely >> terrific players in the U.S. without full-time gigs. That doesn't >> invalidate their effort or achievement -- no more than a gig confers >> upon some of the incompetent folks employed out there any extra respect. >> >> Disclaimer: I'm arguing with the content of the message quoted, not the >> person. My answer may seem harsh to some, but it's because I believe the >> debate to be badly imbalanced and too reductive. -------------------- I must admit, I found this original post rather combative and heavily leaning to one side, however, the first paragraph cited here is quite valid and very important for people to hear. There were important things said throughout that original post that probably got lost on many due to tone. As it is always my goal to listen for content and not manner, it was not lost on me. Good to read some truly intelligent discourse on the list. -------------------- >I want to second your response, and a question of my own. > >At what point did our Universities become trade schools? I personally don't see >the University to have any necessary role in training anyone for a job. The role >of undergraduate education is to teach the student how to learn, and especially >how to teach themselves. > >Those things are best taught through a medium that the student likes -- it might >be music or mathematics, physics or philosophy. There is time to specialize later, >if that's what you want to do. > >Or, as Socrates put it: hand him a gold coin and send him away if he feels he must >profit from all knowledge. -------------------- The Socratic method of teaching bears little resemblance to teaching in the U.S. in 2000 unfortunately. Interesting aside: the Greeks did not value virtuosity and saw it as indulgent and unbalanced. It was their goal to attain great balance in education. Not a bad goal if each facet of investigation goes deep enough to produce a true intellectual balance and not just people who know enough trivia to do well on Jeopardy. MC -------------------- > >Dennis >-- > >Dennis L. Clason email: dclason@nmsu.edu >Department of Economics / University Statistics Center >New Mexico State University >Las Cruces, New Mexico USA > From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:21 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 09:34:46 -0800 From: "Rodney Ellard" To: Cc: Subject: Re: Range Message-ID: <00a601bf6691$503b0700$8eee94d1@rod> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Does anyone know where to obtain Phil Teele's bass trombone exercises? Rod From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:21 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 10:50:43 MST From: Dennis Clason To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: College, Money, and Torture Message-ID: <200001241751.KAA180698@nestor.NMSU.Edu> Addressed to: astro@pconline.com trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu ** Reply to note from Mike Coyle 01/24/00 11:15am -0600 >> Or, as Socrates put it: hand him a gold coin and send him away if he feels >> he must profit from all knowledge. > > -------------------- > > The Socratic method of teaching bears little resemblance to teaching in > the U.S. in 2000 unfortunately. Interesting aside: the Greeks did not value > virtuosity and saw it as indulgent and unbalanced. It was their goal to > attain great balance in education. Not a bad goal if each facet of > investigation goes deep enough to produce a true intellectual balance and > not just people who know enough trivia to do well on Jeopardy. I wasn't making a plea for Socratic methods of teaching (although I believe in them), and I agree that they are uncommon in higher ed today. There are a few hold-outs -- some small liberal arts schools, and graduate education (at least in the sciences), and (interestingly enough) music performance. The fact is that Socratic methods are very labor intensive, and therefore not cost-effective for education factories. But the ideal remains -- education is usually a good thing, even if it doesn't immediately lead into a career. When I decided not to major in music, I chose biology. I wanted to either go to medical school, or become a marine biologist. Fortunately, I had the opportunity to talk to one of the faculty at Scripps Institute in San Diego. He gave me some invaluable advice (and what's really amazing is that I took it!). "Don't get a bachelor's degree in marine biology, or any other specialty area. Get yourself a solid grounding in biology, so you know what the questions are and how they relate to other areas of science." I completed my AB at one of those little liberal arts schools that believed in the Socratic method (only they called it "inquiry"). I got through (with honors), kicking and screaming, because my friends that went to real.schools like UCLA and Stanford got their questions answered, not a couple of pointers into the library! I didn't understand the value of what I received until I was in graduate school -- I was much better prepped than my friends who had gone to real.schools. It really doesn't matter (much) what you major in, provided that you learn how to teach yourself the things you need to know. Now, if you want to specialize in statistics, please do us all a favor and take the prerequisite higher mathematics. If you want to specialize in marine biology, take all the prerequisite anatomy, physiology and ecology. But there's a lot of room for discovery within getting the prerequisites. The bottom line: I can't tell you exactly how you might profit by knowing the Central Limit Theorem. If you must have an immediate profit from understanding, please go elsewhere. Dennis -- Dennis -- Dennis L. Clason email: dclason@nmsu.edu Department of Economics / University Statistics Center New Mexico State University Las Cruces, New Mexico USA From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:21 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 12:52:09 EST From: NHSGrizzly16@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Range Message-ID: <2.7ff2f3.25bdeb49@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit long tones......long tones.......and more long tones From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:21 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 12:59:58 -0500 From: jmonten@ryeneck.k12.ny.us To: Subject: List Commands ? Message-ID: <0001249487.AA948736818@mailhub.ryeneck.k12.ny.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: "cc:Mail Note Part" After using the Postpone mail command, what is the appropriate command to start mail again ?? John From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:21 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 13:27:04 -0500 From: Douglas Yeo To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Monday and getting quite high on a morning mate. Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain ; format="flowed" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit At 8:28 AM -0800 1/24/00, Daniel Pliskin wrote: >Iâd like to suggest that the reason you (Doug) sound so good is >because he simply leaves his horn in the trunk of his car, at night. >That way, he gets (no, actually his horn gets) free Cryo treatments, >up there in Boston. Actually, I leave my embouchure in the car over night and it gets the cryo treatment, too. Nothing like it in the morning. Of course, the horn sounds better if I leave it out overnight in my Ford Escort rather than my Windstar van, but everyone knows that. And you have to keep the spit valve open, too, that makes all the difference. Now that the secret is out, everyone will be moving to New England - wow, what a free lance pool we'll have! :-) -Doug ********************************************** * Douglas Yeo * * Bass Trombonist, Boston Symphony Orchestra * * Music Director, The New England Brass Band * * yeo@yeodoug.com * * http://www.yeodoug.com * * <>< * ********************************************** From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:22 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 12:53:17 -0600 From: Mike Coyle To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Monday and getting quite high on a morning mate. Message-ID: <200001241853.MAA05985@newton.pconline.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 12:27 PM 1/24/00 , you wrote: >At 8:28 AM -0800 1/24/00, Daniel Pliskin wrote: > >>I’d like to suggest that the reason you (Doug) sound so good is >>because he simply leaves his horn in the trunk of his car, at night. >>That way, he gets (no, actually his horn gets) free Cryo treatments, >>up there in Boston. > >Actually, I leave my embouchure in the car over night and it gets the >cryo treatment, too. Nothing like it in the morning. Of course, the >horn sounds better if I leave it out overnight in my Ford Escort >rather than my Windstar van, but everyone knows that. And you have >to keep the spit valve open, too, that makes all the difference. Now >that the secret is out, everyone will be moving to New England - wow, >what a free lance pool we'll have! > >:-) > >-Doug Lemme tell you guys somethin' You don't know what cold is till you've lived in Minnesota in February! Why on Earth would Norwegians who came from an inhuman environment to being with (I won't even try get into their theology which is enough to break the heart of the stoutest man), and then settle in a place that has the same kind of winters? Somethin' just ain't right here :) Coyle > > ********************************************** > * Douglas Yeo * > * Bass Trombonist, Boston Symphony Orchestra * > * Music Director, The New England Brass Band * > * yeo@yeodoug.com * > * http://www.yeodoug.com * > * <>< * > ********************************************** > > From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:22 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 13:28:26 -0600 From: Listmonitor Trombone-L To: Trombone-L Subject: Re: List Commands ? Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" John: To re-start the delivery of messages, send an e-mail to LISTPROC@LISTS.MISSOURI.EDU with SET TROMBONE-L MAIL ACK in the body of the message. LM >After using the Postpone mail command, what is the appropriate command to >start >mail again ?? >John --------------------------------------- trombone-l digest archives and useful trombone-l information are available at http://www.cjnetworks.com/~tsks From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:22 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 13:43:52 -0600 From: Mike Coyle To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: List Commands ? Message-ID: <200001241944.NAA10765@newton.pconline.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dear List Monitor. What is the command to get only kind, thoughtful and revelant replies to your posts? Mic Coil Vater, vergib ihnen, denn sie wissen nicht, was sie tun. From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:22 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 14:53:14 -0500 From: richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: standards and auditions Message-ID: <21E592FA8BA7D311B5B100062B001FE2082EE5@LEE2> This is sheer wishful thinking, and few of you will think there is any value in it. But, part of the reason people audition who have no chance is there is no standard evaluation system. Think about it, every chess player has a rating. Golfers, bowlers have a handicap. That really tells you pretty well where they stand. Tennis and racketball players I guess are rated A, B, C, or something. Of course this would be for technical skill only, I don't see how you could make it work for artistry. But i can see rating technical skill on a percentile, or a hundred point scale. A 95th percentile bone is pretty good, will be an asset to any community orchestra - but you'd better be 99th to even think about BSO. What am I? I don't know (beyond that I'm not ready to send Doug a tape.) I would love to go to a local community band and have the director say, " Tim, you're a 42. I'm sorry, I have drawn the line at 61 this year, I can't use you." I'd know i shouldn't be playing in that band, and I'd know exactly what i had to do to get there. Wouldn't that save some frustrations and hurt feelings? If you are a music major, enter at 60%, gain 5% a year, you're pretty good relatively speaking - but you know that symphony career is only an idle dream. I encourage people to go for their dream - if they have a realistic chance. What does happen in music school? (i've never been there, he said slightly enviously) Everybody gets an A, right? Well, it was a thought, anyway. Ad it would generate a whole industry of raters, people to certify the raters, people to keep track of the records, etc. yours, tim richardson From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:22 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 15:14:01 -0500 From: "Blythe Polreis" To: Subject: valve trombone Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Thanks, everybody, for all the info resulting from my question about large bore valve trombones. Just to let you know, my tuba friend decided that, since he was looking for one to play lead in a swing band, he should stay with a small bore and has aquired a silver-plated 1930 Pan American (made in Elkart). With a little polishing and a trip to the repair shop, he thinks it should serve his needs nicely. Blythe From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:22 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 12:16:21 -0800 From: "Rodney Ellard" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: standards and auditions Message-ID: <000c01bf66a7$e528ef60$9fef94d1@rod> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In my first year of music school, I auditioned for the stage band. The leader told me quite bluntly, "You're not very good." So I practiced. And in 2nd year I got first class marks and improved from there in third and fourth years. Criticism is an essential part of learning. Rod From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:22 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 14:36:42 -0500 From: Charles To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: range Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.20000124193642.006bd5f4@totcon.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" The best book I have seen for developing range and flexibility on the bassbone is: "The F&D Double Valve Bass Trombone" by Paul Faulise (PF Music Co.) Daily work in that book plus long tones will do it!(for range, tone and flexibility) From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:22 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 14:05:29 MST From: Dennis Clason To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Home cryo treatments. Message-ID: <200001242105.OAA248958@nestor.NMSU.Edu> ** Reply to note from Douglas Yeo 01/24/00 1:27pm -0500 > Actually, I leave my embouchure in the car over night and it gets the > cryo treatment, too. Nothing like it in the morning. Of course, the > horn sounds better if I leave it out overnight in my Ford Escort > rather than my Windstar van, but everyone knows that. THAT'S the problem -- I was leaving an American trombone in a Honda Accord! I guess I'll have to get a Yamaha to replace my Bach. Can you make me a deal on a YBL-6xx? > And you have > to keep the spit valve open, too, that makes all the difference. I knew about that already, BUT it has to be held open with white gold springs. Rubber bands or string won't help, and steel springs just won't feel right. Explanation and caveat: the last bit (about springs) is a mild dig at flutisti. If anyone forwards this to my flautist spouse, I'll be forced to do something drastic. Dennis -- Dennis L. Clason email: dclason@nmsu.edu Department of Economics / University Statistics Center New Mexico State University Las Cruces, New Mexico USA From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:22 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 15:05:16 -0600 From: "Brandon Moodie" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: range Message-ID: <000001bf66ae$b6a3e440$f7ce8ad1@c.moodie> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'll second that recomendation. One of the most practical collections of exercises I've found. Only about US$10 the last time I checked too.... --Brandon > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu > [mailto:owner-trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu]On Behalf Of Charles > Sent: Monday, January 24, 2000 1:37 PM > To: Trombones and related issues forum. > Subject: range > > > The best book I have seen for developing range and flexibility on > the bassbone is: > "The F&D Double Valve Bass Trombone" by Paul Faulise (PF Music > Co.) Daily work in that book plus long tones will do it!(for > range, tone and flexibility) > From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:22 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 22:45:29 +0100 From: Anders Carlsson To: Bradley W Main Cc: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Home Studio--Microphones and digital recording equipment Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Not much trombone content here, sorry. If you wan«t a home studio setup on your desktop computer you need certain things, yes. Microphone(s): It«s a jungle, but I recommend a large mebrane condensor mic. Lots of brands and prices available. You will probably need a mixing console to set the ingoing levels right. To import the recording from a mic, or a dat tape, or CD, or a minidisc or whatever format you use, you will need some sort of extra PCI soundcard installed on your computer. Depending on what PCI soundcard you have put in your computer you will need / won«t need a mic preamp. A very good soundcard is the DIGI001 from digitech which has two builtin mic preamps. www.digi001.com A bit expensive but you get A LOT for your money. And it«s still not even proffeesional card. A soundblaster card is NOT a quality soundcard. Those cards are for playing games on a PC but not for a good hard drive recording. For sequensing software someone has already mentioned Cubase VST which is quality stuff. My favourite is however Logic Audio which sometimes seems to sync a little bit better than Cubase. Depending on what kind of music you«re recording and what you wan«t to do with it you should make a choice between a very dry acoustic/vibrant acoustic place to record your music. Some people might not like this but try to use a Macintosh computer instead of a PC. I could explain why in many ways but I won't go there now. ____________________________________________ Anders Carlsson, Gothenburg , Sweden. Brassplayer, arranger, conductor and brassteacher. Anders.Carlsson@gfs.gu.se or trombone@musiker.nu From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:22 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 22:53:26 +0100 From: Anders Carlsson To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: KIng 6B Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit When doing the bottom work in a section I use a King 6B. (I have so far only been playing jazz, pop, and rock music on bass trombone and no classical, and I think it works fine for me). A couple of months ago there was a discussion on the list about the King Duo Gravis bass trombone and as I recall it the Duo Gravis was discontinued but I don«t remember when. The other day I saw a ten year old King catalog and there the King 6B had the name Duo Gravis. So is my instrument a Duo Gravis or just a plain ol« 6B? In that case what was the Duo Gravis? Is anyone playing this horn and what du you like it? ____________________________________________ Anders Carlsson, Gothenburg , Sweden. Brassplayer, arranger, conductor and brassteacher. Anders.Carlsson@gfs.gu.se or trombone@musiker.nu From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:22 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 22:55:24 +0100 From: Anders Carlsson To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Small big band? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Does anybody know where I can find arrangements for small big band with the 2 trumpets 2 trombones and 2 saxes setup. ____________________________________________ Anders Carlsson, Gothenburg , Sweden. Brassplayer, arranger, conductor and brassteacher. Anders.Carlsson@gfs.gu.se or trombone@musiker.nu From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:22 2000 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000 16:23:24 -0500 From: Charles To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: DUO GRAVIS Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.20000124212324.006b17a0@totcon.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" The "Duo Gravis" has double triggers, both operated by the thumb. (VERY AWKWARD)You can have it converted to the contemporary set up. I don't think it's worth it. Some people may like them. I never did, nor any of the bassbone players I know. The 6B you have sounds fine for what you are doing. If you like it, Keep it! I believe Alan Raph uses (or used) a Duo Gravis. He sounds good in spite of it. From ???@??? Tue Jan 25 08:10:22